New Series of Doctor Who

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Avis
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Post by Avis » Tue, 18. Jul 17, 11:00

Making the Doctor female is a none story to be honest, I don't think it will detract in any shape or form from 'Dr Who' as a series, might actually open up new possibilities in a positive way.

That said, I do feel the whole 'as a feminist' comment by Jodie and the BBCs whole 'ooo look a woman, solidarity sister' crap, I can't help but feel there is an element of deliberate drama creation to get an otherwise none story more publicity.

I know some people will disagree, Dr Who's real problem is the lazy shoddy writing, I hope that changes more than the change of gender which without decent writing won't make any difference, let the bloody cybermen, statues, darleks and all the old tropes have a break the writers should try coming up with something new each week not simply roll out old faithful just 'because'.

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TSM
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Post by TSM » Tue, 18. Jul 17, 11:48

Avis wrote:I know some people will disagree, Dr Who's real problem is the lazy shoddy writing, I hope that changes more than the change of gender which without decent writing won't make any difference, let the bloody cybermen, statues, darleks and all the old tropes have a break the writers should try coming up with something new each week not simply roll out old faithful just 'because'.
Aye tottally agree there. new writer starts after Xmas special so fingers crossed it goes somewhere now.
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clakclak
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Post by clakclak » Tue, 18. Jul 17, 12:27

TSM wrote:[...]
There is a precedent here BSG changed Boomer and Starbuck to female worked out very well in my opinion.
Dirk Benedict (the actor who played Starbuck in the original) however was deeply offended by it (one may say triggered):
Dirk Benedict wrote:[...]Women are from Venus. Men are from Mars. Hamlet does not scan as Hamletta. Nor does Hans Solo as Hans Sally. Faceman is not the same as Facewoman. Nor does a Stardoe a Starbuck make. Men hand out cigars. Women “hand out” babies. And thus the world for thousands of years has gone’ round.[...]
Laugh and the world laughs with you,
Weep, and you weep alone;
The good old earth must borrow its mirth,
But has trouble enough of its own.

- Ella Wheeler Wilcox

Bishop149
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Post by Bishop149 » Tue, 18. Jul 17, 15:17

I agree with Avis, mostly a non story, totally within the lore / ethos of the show and could result in some interesting stuff.

My chief concern about a female Dr Who however is as follows (and again mirrors some of Avis' post).

The show has had a serious writing problem for a Loooooong time, the latest season has been better but most of Capaldi's reign and the latter end of Matt Smith have been bad. . . . utter dross at times. This is clearly NOT going to change, the showrunners have been told repeatedly and very loudly and have essentially just egotistically stuck their heads in the sand in response to this very valid criticism.

Now the prevailing narrative from fans about this and Capaldi seems to have been: "Uggg its such a shame to see a talented actor wasted on these crappy scripts!". I fear that with the advent of a female Doctor sexism will change the EXACT same problem into "See! A woman is crap at being the Doctor"
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Antilogic
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Post by Antilogic » Tue, 18. Jul 17, 15:41

Bishop149 wrote: I fear that with the advent of a female Doctor sexism will change the EXACT same problem into "See! A woman is crap at being the Doctor"
These scum would say this whatever.

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Post by pjknibbs » Tue, 18. Jul 17, 17:17

Bishop149 wrote:This is clearly NOT going to change, the showrunners have been told repeatedly and very loudly and have essentially just egotistically stuck their heads in the sand in response to this very valid criticism.
Er, you realise the showrunners are all changing as well? Doesn't matter how much the previous showrunners stuck their heads in the sand if they're not involved in the new one.

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Post by Bishop149 » Tue, 18. Jul 17, 18:54

pjknibbs wrote:Er, you realise the showrunners are all changing as well? Doesn't matter how much the previous showrunners stuck their heads in the sand if they're not involved in the new one.
Well, I'd personally advocate that the problems name is Steven Moffat. :roll:
Is he going? If he is then yay maybe we'll see some changes. . . . finally.

Edit: Ah I see he is. WHY WASN'T THIS THE BIG DR WHO NEWS!! Far more likely to result in substantive change than the casting of a woman.
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matthewfarmery
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Post by matthewfarmery » Wed, 19. Jul 17, 17:45

I guess no one read what I said on page one, as I pretty much also made the same comments as Avis.

The problem is the scriptwriters, and yes, Steven Moffat is leaving. He might be good at doing episodes, "Blink"

But after that, when he took over, the series in general took a major nose dive.

And Matt Smith could have been a lot better if he had decent scripts.

Which is why, this change is do or die, if it flops, that it, won't be watching it no more.

I also hope they introduce new enemies, and better story arcs. similar to quality to "River Song" and her introduction. but we not really seen quality like that for a while. (in my view)

I hope the changes are for the better, we will see how it goes, I just hope it gets dragged from the gutter, or should be left to gracefully die.
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Antilogic
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Post by Antilogic » Wed, 19. Jul 17, 22:39

But after that, when he took over, the series in general took a major nose dive.
Matter of opinion.

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BugMeister
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Post by BugMeister » Thu, 20. Jul 17, 00:22

- when Janeway was made the lead role in Voyager, the saga took on new themes..
- the stories become more character-centred, maybe the overarching search for the home planet gave it a different impetus as well..

- I thought some of the female roles in 2nd Gen gave it a new edge as well - casting Whoopie Goldberg was inspirational..
- Firefly had a feminine side, as well - very thoughtfully written..

- Dr Who could lose some of the more bombastic music in the soundtrack, as well
- some of it's a bit over the top..

How about bringing back K9 and giving the electro-dog some clever dialogue..
- the whole universe is running in BETA mode - we're working on it.. beep..!! :D :thumb_up:

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Usenko
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Post by Usenko » Mon, 24. Jul 17, 14:48

I have been thinking about the 13th Doctor, and I have a few thoughts:

1) There is no question as to the quality of the actress chosen. Several of my friends have seen her acting before (though I personally have not), and they have declared her to have the chops. She can do it well.

2) Chibnall and the scriptwriters are the key.

3) There IS one big issue with a female Doctor:
There is really only one consistent feature of the Doctor's personality - he is a bumbling twit, an idiot-savant whose one brilliant talent is saving the universe!

I don't believe I have seen a female play a part in this way[1], and I wonder if the scriptwriters have the courage to give Whittaker these kinds of scripts. If they do, it will mean that the character will be consistent, and there is potential for a brilliant success, in that it would be fresh and interesting.

If not? Well, there's a new person with the NAME of the Doctor, but not the CHARACTER.

[1] This is not to say it's never been done. Just not something I have seen.
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Post by pjknibbs » Mon, 24. Jul 17, 16:57

Usenko wrote: There is really only one consistent feature of the Doctor's personality - he is a bumbling twit, an idiot-savant whose one brilliant talent is saving the universe!
I would have to disagree strongly with that assessment. The Doctor is not a bumbling twit or an idiot savant. What he is, is an alien with an alien viewpoint and ideas, and the best actors have portrayed him as such (Tom Baker and Peter Capaldi spring to mind here, how I wish the latter would have had a decent showrunner and some good scripts to work with).

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BigBANGtheory
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Post by BigBANGtheory » Mon, 24. Jul 17, 20:48

I liked the Christopher Eccleston portrayal of Dr Who but after that the regenerated series lost it for me I don't know if I can return... the female concept does intrigue me though I'm not against that and wonder if the BBC will put extra effort into Dr Who as a result cos there has been some real shite; true of the older generations too I always felt Colin Baker was let down by the production rather his acting where as Sylvester McCoy was the reverse.

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Usenko
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Post by Usenko » Tue, 25. Jul 17, 10:51

pjknibbs wrote:
Usenko wrote: There is really only one consistent feature of the Doctor's personality - he is a bumbling twit, an idiot-savant whose one brilliant talent is saving the universe!
I would have to disagree strongly with that assessment. The Doctor is not a bumbling twit or an idiot savant. What he is, is an alien with an alien viewpoint and ideas, and the best actors have portrayed him as such (Tom Baker and Peter Capaldi spring to mind here, how I wish the latter would have had a decent showrunner and some good scripts to work with).
Fair point.

An alien, with an alien viewpoint, who to unpractised human eyes appears to be a bumbling twit, an idiot savant, with a talent for saving the universe. :D

Seriously, I get where you're coming from, and you're quite correct. But the point I'm making is that the image of the doctor is one that is quite solidly flawed (from the audience's viewpoint), and some of those flaws are flaws we seem to be uncomfortable with ascribing to women. If the scriptwriters are willing to embrace that discomfort and write the 13th Doctor with those familiar eccentricities and flaws, then the result will at the very least be an interesting character.

(It is quite possible that the show could suck even with a successful character - there is more to a show than the acting - but if so, it at least won't be because of Whittaker).
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Post by Graphil » Tue, 25. Jul 17, 20:11

I thought they did a great job with the female master so I don't see why they can't pull it off with a female doctor too.
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