Questions about the Present and the Future...

General discussions about X Rebirth.

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Graaf
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Post by Graaf » Tue, 5. May 15, 07:32

XenonSurf wrote:@Graaf,

Another flyable ship? Take another cockpit and change the external ship textures (that you don't see anyway, except in External View), and there you go, you fly another ship.
Sorry, but I could mod such a pathetic thing in 10 minutes... So what's the point in that? It doesn't change the gameplay for 1 yota.
Besides: There are already a couple of nice cockpits, so they don't even need to be modded...
But I do not want to sit idle playing Rebirth's Transport Management game in a slightly altered, yet still useless Skunk. I want to fly a transport ship and do actual trading with the stations.

It's nice to have CBJ call it the continuous request for additional pilotable ships, but its more about the lack of gameplay styles due to the single ship limitation. Adding more fighters doesn't solve that, or my, issue.


And to a lesser degree they told us the Skunk would be an iconic ship, like the Millennium Falcon or the Serenity, yet they forgot that both of those are transport ships.

pref
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Post by pref » Tue, 5. May 15, 09:51

AdánPasos wrote: Many of us find Rebirth really exciting to play since very recently only (and many are still waiting for new content before playing "really"). If Ego releases a new game basically as a complete improvement from Rebirth, what motivation we'll have left to play Rebirth?
As CBJ clearly stated, they will also improve XR (patches and DLC).
For those who like XR - they already have a nice game they can play with, and it will be improved even further.
If you play rebirth for its own merits, and not only because nothing better is available, have no idea why you have concerns. You have a game you already like, and it's getting better.

But there are quite a few potential players longing for something else (compare first month player stats to the 2nd). Never understood why ppl who like XR mind if the rest also has a game to play. XR just doesn't cut it for many.

It's not like they will drop everything else and rush into releasing a new game - will likely take a couple of years until they can release X4.

XenonSurf
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Post by XenonSurf » Tue, 5. May 15, 15:34

Graaf wrote: But I do not want to sit idle playing Rebirth's Transport Management game in a slightly altered, yet still useless Skunk. I want to fly a transport ship and do actual trading with the stations.

It's nice to have CBJ call it the continuous request for additional pilotable ships, but its more about the lack of gameplay styles due to the single ship limitation. Adding more fighters doesn't solve that, or my, issue.
All this you can actually do it in the current XR 3.53.

You don't have to stay in your Skunk, you can move to a bigger transport ship and take command from there, flying the transport. That's what I'm doing right now.
If you want to be on a 'bridge' instead of in a hangar, you will have to use a mod (see my first response to OP).

Your answers in this post bring me to ask: Are you sure you have been playing this game before giving such severe critics to it and the developers?
Telling a dev that his game has no future is not the thing to do IMO :twisted:

XenonS

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mr.WHO
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Post by mr.WHO » Tue, 5. May 15, 18:13

The problem is not that we have a full control over only one ship, but the problem is that this ship lack not only customization, but even the upgrades (there are like maybe 10 upgrades in total and they are basically shields C replaces shields B which replaces shield A).

There should be multiple interior and exterior customizations where we could configure our very own Skunk.

You want to install turrets on Skunk? Your should be!
You want to have 1,2 3 or 4 chained Particle Repeaters? you should be?
Bigger drone hold? bigger missile hold? Faster engine, better bosters? Shield regeneration? Cloaking field? anti-missile flares? experimental mini-jump drive? More marines/crew hold? More armor? laser energy?

Interior should be at least 3 times bigger (on concept arts Skunk had 2 or 3 decks). You should be able to buy stuff for interior, like mini-command table where you could issue/access command over your assets, furnitures/decorations.

The posiblities are very robust - I hoped for them when they introduced the customizable cokpit, but unfortunately not much progress was made since then.


I like Skunk and I can stay with it - I spent most of my X3:TC time in a Vidar. Unfortunately for Skunk, the Vidar was much more customizable and upgradable.

jambock1978
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Post by jambock1978 » Tue, 5. May 15, 18:30

mr.WHO wrote:The problem is not that we have a full control over only one ship, but the problem is that this ship lack not only customization, but even the upgrades (there are like maybe 10 upgrades in total and they are basically shields C replaces shields B which replaces shield A).

There should be multiple interior and exterior customizations where we could configure our very own Skunk.

You want to install turrets on Skunk? Your should be!
You want to have 1,2 3 or 4 chained Particle Repeaters? you should be?
Bigger drone hold? bigger missile hold? Faster engine, better bosters? Shield regeneration? Cloaking field? anti-missile flares? experimental mini-jump drive? More marines/crew hold? More armor? laser energy?

Interior should be at least 3 times bigger (on concept arts Skunk had 2 or 3 decks). You should be able to buy stuff for interior, like mini-command table where you could issue/access command over your assets, furnitures/decorations.

The posiblities are very robust - I hoped for them when they introduced the customizable cokpit, but unfortunately not much progress was made since then.


I like Skunk and I can stay with it - I spent most of my X3:TC time in a Vidar. Unfortunately for Skunk, the Vidar was much more customizable and upgradable.
Sincerely, i like those ideas. It would make me think in buy the game while i wait for "TNBT"; if those were well implemented. these would ease even the need of new player ships for a while, if we could make the Skunk bigger (losing speed and maneuverability but gaining firepower and/or Cargo space), making it seems different and feel different. it stills the same ship, but "inside" another one, it would become like the bridge of the ship and no more the ship. multiple turrets are a need for sure! Just my toughs.
Last edited by jambock1978 on Tue, 5. May 15, 18:44, edited 2 times in total.

Graaf
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Post by Graaf » Tue, 5. May 15, 18:31

XenonSurf wrote:You don't have to stay in your Skunk, you can move to a bigger transport ship and take command from there, flying the transport. That's what I'm doing right now.
If you want to be on a 'bridge' instead of in a hangar, you will have to use a mod (see my first response to OP).
Correct me if I'm wrong but as far as I can tell I would still not be piloting that ship. I'm merely a passenger. I'll basically sit idle on board another ship playing the Transport Management game.

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BigBANGtheory
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Post by BigBANGtheory » Tue, 5. May 15, 18:39

I'm looking forward to see which features have made the "lets take this into development" cut. I always expected to see significant updates and features as part of a new product and take no issue with that.

Despite X3:TC being a superior game to X3:R the progression was left wanting imho, the successor to XR needs some pretty radical changes or additions imho.

I know Egosoft has its own policy about sharing their in-development focus and attentions publically, but guys seriously if you take that gamble again and get it wrong again I'm not sure where that leaves you. Get a focus group of players (your choice who) and a couple of press, get them the sign an NDA then show or tell them what you have in mind and ffs listen to what they say your future depends on it.

XenonSurf
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Post by XenonSurf » Tue, 5. May 15, 19:22

mr.WHO wrote:
Interior should be at least 3 times bigger (...)
Well that's all very nice, we all can dream about more features, more interiors etc., but you don't seem to realize that the game engine has its limits. E.g. Have you tried to load an intensive mod like the mentioned CAP Ship Bridge or others? Ever figured out why Egosoft didn't put these in the game?
It's not Egosoft that will (or should) tell you that the engine or computer technology has limits :D Requesting features is one thing, implementing them and making them *work* is another. I don't blame them for not succeeding all in one step.

I'm much more interested that Egosoft will make the things *work* that actually are in the game, first the little things like picking up cargo containers in Cargo Scan Mode correctly etc. etc. I feel that a lot such things need to be corrected first before adding new stuff. And That's what they've told they are doing (see stickies), and I'm glad about it.
So, yes, the game HAS future. :)

@Egosoft,
be so kind and make an object and texture count for the Hangar interior; and then implement a smaller BRIDGE of the same size 8) Should NOT pose FPS or other performance problems.
This will get a lot of players less confused about not being able to command other ships...

XenonS
Last edited by XenonSurf on Tue, 5. May 15, 19:35, edited 2 times in total.

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mr.WHO
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Post by mr.WHO » Tue, 5. May 15, 19:33

Improvements from X3:Reunion to X3:Terran Conflict that I remember:
- bigger universe
- more ship types
- new race (Terrans)
- GUI upgrades (right-click menu on the map screen)
- multiple side plots
- replacing of bulletin board with station icons for generic missions, more generic mission types
- more weapon types (General/Teladi, Terran, Argon-Boron, Spit-Paranit)


Now what I'd see for XR:"Terran Conflict"
- bigger universe (at least 3-5 new systems, both developed and empty/ lawless ones)
- more ships types (Frigates, real fighter-capable carriers with proper carrier script)
- new race (Terrans!! The real ones, the angry, Argon-eating ones!)
- GUI upgrades (let me give ship commands and waypoints from map screen, make better squad & property management screen and for god sake let me remotely call the shipyards OOZ)
- multiple side plots (at least one for every major faction)
- more generic mission types
- more weapon types (each system/race should have at least a few local weapon types just like in X3:TC)
- player HQ / Shipyards


For such XR:"Terran Conflict" I'd be willing to pay 50$ right away!

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mr.WHO
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Post by mr.WHO » Tue, 5. May 15, 19:41

XenonSurf wrote:
Well that's all very nice, we all can dream about more features, more interiors etc., but you don't seem to realize that the game engine has its limits. E.g. Have you tried to load an intensive mod like the mentioned CAP Ship Bridge or others? Ever figured out why Egosoft didn't put these in the game?
It's not Egosoft that will (or should) tell you that the engine or computer technology has limits :D Requesting features is one thing, implementing them and making them *work* is another. I don't blame them for not succeeding all in one step.
XenonS
Umh, HELLO! I'm not asking for Ship Bridge, I' asking for bigger Skunk interior - this means no windows/cokpit view. Current Skunk interior excluding cokpit is 3 rooms (or to be more precise 1 room, 1 cargo room and one toilet). If I ask for 3xbigger interior it's basically 9 rooms which is the same size of station interior. Nothing requiring Alienware-grade computer.

XenonSurf
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Post by XenonSurf » Tue, 5. May 15, 20:04

@Who,

It's here...
http://steamcommunity.com/workshop/brow ... ction=home

Try to google yourself next time.

And yes you need Alienware-grade.

XS

Graaf
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Post by Graaf » Tue, 5. May 15, 20:05

XenonSurf wrote:... first the little things like picking up cargo containers in Cargo Scan Mode correctly etc. etc.
Didn't they add a tractor-beam for that in one of the latest patches?
Version 3.50 (192864) - 2015-03-12 wrote:• Added "Container Magnet" which attracts nearby collectables to the player ship (now with key for activation).

XenonSurf wrote: I feel that a lot such things need to be corrected first before adding new stuff. And That's what they've told they are doing (see stickies), and I'm glad about it.
We could use an update on that progress report. I think a lot of people are waiting to jump on that Priority 3 phase. Although it's more like asking for the communities permission in stead of listening to what the community wants.

XenonSurf
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Post by XenonSurf » Tue, 5. May 15, 20:17

Graaf wrote: Didn't they add a tractor-beam for that in one of the latest patches?
Version 3.50 (192864) - 2015-03-12 wrote:• Added "Container Magnet" which attracts nearby collectables to the player ship (now with key for activation).
Yes, it's great that they have added this, saves me a lot of time flying around to get them :)
But it will work only with Wares, not cargo containers. For these to collect you need a transport ship, enough space in it, and cargo drones able to collect them. Not sure, but all this (together with the Cargo Scan mode) doesn't seem to work :cry:

XenonS

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mr.WHO
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Post by mr.WHO » Tue, 5. May 15, 20:37

XenonSurf wrote:@Who,

It's here...
http://steamcommunity.com/workshop/brow ... ction=home

Try to google yourself next time.

And yes you need Alienware-grade.

XS
Next time learn to read better and know X-Rebirth better before you try the irony.


I did not asked for non-cokpit mod. I was specificaly refering to the "Sunk interior" part that is dispayed when you go to section behind the cokpit room.

The thing why Bridge mod is so demanding is not only the size and details of the interior, but also the need to display the external universe via bridge window in the same time.
Skunk interior don't have this problem, so you can make it bigger with no noticable performance impact.
Last edited by mr.WHO on Tue, 5. May 15, 21:50, edited 1 time in total.

Thufar
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Post by Thufar » Tue, 5. May 15, 21:15

XenonSurf wrote:For these to collect you need a transport ship, enough space in it, and cargo drones able to collect them. Not sure, but all this (together with the Cargo Scan mode) doesn't seem to work
Did some of this over the weekend. The only thing you didn't mention is the cap ship to do the collecting must not have any other orders other than being in your squad and Following Skunk.

Regards,
Thu

Nanook
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Post by Nanook » Tue, 5. May 15, 22:38

XenonSurf wrote:....
But it will work only with Wares, not cargo containers. For these to collect you need a transport ship, enough space in it, and cargo drones able to collect them. Not sure, but all this (together with the Cargo Scan mode) doesn't seem to work :cry:

XenonS
Not sure what your problem is, but it works just fine for me. I can make a pretty good living hacking cargo ships and collecting all the dropped containers. Once the technique is learned, it's pretty easy. But like all rewarding things, one needs to put a little effort into learning how to do it. :wink:
Have a great idea for the current or a future game? You can post it in the [L3+] Ideas forum.

X4 is a journey, not a destination. Have fun on your travels.

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Post by XenonSurf » Tue, 5. May 15, 23:28

Thufar,
thanks, I'm aware of this, to make sure of it I even have sent my CAP back-and-return from another zone, it doesn't work, if you don't order "Follow me again", the CAP will not fly into your zone.
the "Tag" order for collecting cargo does NOT appear (I still have the quicksave, will try again though).

@Who,
sorry no irony here, I obviously didn't understand you: what's wrong with the 'Interior'? If it's this what your mean:
I agree that the standard cockpit view is .. [TAKEN OUT]

[EDIT]
No, no, it's not what you mean... you mean the CREW QUARTERS. But what's wrong with them? The only time I go there is to read the mission briefing (with the Mission Computer mod) because of this cr** perspective window that I'm just modding (see No Perspective View once finished), or to send my pilots or crew to cap ships...


XenonS
Last edited by XenonSurf on Wed, 6. May 15, 00:38, edited 5 times in total.

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Nikola515
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Post by Nikola515 » Tue, 5. May 15, 23:42

BigBANGtheory wrote:I'm looking forward to see which features have made the "lets take this into development" cut. I always expected to see significant updates and features as part of a new product and take no issue with that.

Despite X3:TC being a superior game to X3:R the progression was left wanting imho, the successor to XR needs some pretty radical changes or additions imho.

I know Egosoft has its own policy about sharing their in-development focus and attentions publically, but guys seriously if you take that gamble again and get it wrong again I'm not sure where that leaves you. Get a focus group of players (your choice who) and a couple of press, get them the sign an NDA then show or tell them what you have in mind and ffs listen to what they say your future depends on it.
You are right and especially about that NDA bull.... Now after XR even if they get new product people are going to think it is a same junk so without any information about it they are probably not going to pay any attention... Making the same mistake twice and expecting a different outcome is just stupid.... XR is proof of that and if they are going to do it again it is not going to be mistake but their choice :roll: That's why I want them to do early access or closed beta...... This way they can make changes before it is too late. Also if next game is not same or better than X3 games im not even going to bother getting it. As for XR I think they noticed that nobody is plying it anymore and their sales are not going well so they are thinking of making new game (that's my opinion). As for one ship game they can look at how Dark Star One turned out to be and that ship was better 100% than Skunk :roll:
It's not world hunger because we can't feed poor,it's because there will never be enough to feed the rich .....

XenonSurf
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Post by XenonSurf » Wed, 6. May 15, 00:07

Nanook wrote:
Not sure what your problem is, but it works just fine for me. I can make a pretty good living hacking cargo ships and collecting all the dropped containers. Once the technique is learned, it's pretty easy. But like all rewarding things, one needs to put a little effort into learning how to do it. :wink:
Hi Nanook,
thanks to respond. From what you say, I'll just assume it's doable. Must be some spoiler-related stuff. If so, I'm OK with that.

Thanks,
XenonS

Snafu_X3
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Post by Snafu_X3 » Wed, 6. May 15, 05:23

I've just finished a brief note over in /spoilers that may help - let me know there if what I've written doesn't work in general, & here if it doesn't work in particular :)

http://forum.egosoft.com/viewtopic.php? ... 89#4522389
Wiki X:R 1st Tit capping
Wiki X3:TC vanilla: Guide to generic missions, Guide to finding & capping Aran
Never played AP; all X3 advice is based on vanilla+bonus pack TC or before: AP has not changed much WRT general advice.

I know how to spell teladiuminumiumium, I just don't know when to stop!

Dom (Wiki Moderator) 8-) DxDiag

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