Greetings,
I am having an issue with collecting cargo containers near stations. The steps to recreate are:
1. Hack station to get it to dump cargo containers
2. Enter cargo collection mode and tag containers for collection
In order to assist with identifying the problem I have a save made with the cargo ready to collect and the Rahanas in position:
http://wikisend.com/download/928220/save_007.zip - Unedited and no mods were used.
To verify the issue one can use the above save to boost in and tag a few of the cargo containers directly in front of the skunk (about 1 km away since i didn't want to save next to the station police). After tagging you'll notice nothing happens. I waited until the canisters exploded and nothing ever happened so I am quite certain it is broken. It was the same in 2.50 but since 2.51 dropped earlier I updated and tried it again without success.
I suspect that the Rahanas doesn't want to launch collection URV's because it is too far away, but also won't move in closer because AI won't allow it to get too close to the station.. I tried several approaches like tagging and leaving - but the Rahanas just follows me without ever collecting. Advice for things I can do to make it work is greatly appreciated other than save game edits.
Things I've tried so far:
Tagging cans then saving and loading to see if the Rahanas would launch drones, it did not work. In fact saving after tagging causes the tagged containers to be unhighlighted, although they may still be tagged since I couldn't retag them.
UPDATE:
I've confirmed this is not a bug. Cargo collection mode just doesn't work well if you have too many cargolifters on your freighter. This is because you have to tag a number of crates equal to your cargolifters to get the process to begin. The best work around I can suggest is to lower the number of cargo lifters to an amount you can live with. In my case reducing my cargo lifters from 50 to 20 has made the current system workable.
To the devs: This behavior although not a bug is completely unintuitive. It doesn't make sense that more cargo lifters makes cargo collection more difficult to use. More likely, the average player would assume more cargo collectors is better. Although I recommended giving the player some feedback as to how many they need to tag in order to begin the process, I think it might be better to adjust the logic to fit more in line with the players behavior. If the player tags 10 crates and doesn't tag any more for 3-5 minutes then force collection to start early.
2.51 - Cargo container collection issue [WORKAROUND FOUND]
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2.51 - Cargo container collection issue [WORKAROUND FOUND]
Last edited by zanzal on Sun, 19. Oct 14, 04:38, edited 3 times in total.
Since 2.51 I get quite some Errorspam when collecting cargo, I wonder if this is related somehow.
Example like this, the log is full of them.
Example like this, the log is full of them.
Code: Select all
[20.000000]={
["gamestart"]=1.000000,
["message"]="Error: GetDistanceTo failed in component. No common context found between component 'component: Munitionscontainer (ID: 514212) - class: class U::CollectableAmmo - cached-parent: component: Leerer Raum (ID: 176631) - class: class U::Zone' and component 'component: Albion Skunk (ID: 46020) - class: class U::ShipSmall\
child of: component: Leerer Raum (ID: 176631) - class: class U::Zone\
child of: component: Zone Sigma (ID: 14208) - class: class U::Sector\
child of: component: Mahlstrom (ID: 14201) - class: class U::Cluster\
child of: component: Galaxie (ID: 4440) - class: class U::Galaxy'.",
["timestamp"]=1413604450.000000,}
I just loaded your savegame, went in and tagged the containers, I did that from fairly close as just bumped into them, once I tagged all, I flow back to your ship and it was releasing the cargolifters for pick up, apart from one try were I was scanned by police, second try went very smooth, screenshot:
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/f ... =328230330
Did try again and it released the cargolifters.
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/f ... =328230330
Did try again and it released the cargolifters.
A por ellos que son pocos y cobardes
Well santi, you must have some secret to how its done. I tried it again twice and no luck:
1. Tagging a few containers I want, move to the Rahanas - Rahanas is never as close to the station as in your screenshot. Although it does appear to be maneuvering around maybe trying to get closer, when I fly back to it then it stops moving and never releases drones.
2. Tagging a few containers I want and hiding in station nearby to give the Rahanas time to maneuver. In this case my Rahanas decided it wanted to maneuver around and ended up farther away from the containers when the containers started to explode.
Now I did not try tagging all the containers because I do not want all the containers, so I am hoping that is not a requirement. Although the extra time spent tagging might have given the Rahanas more time to maneuver hiding in the station didn't achieve similar results, so I am at a loss.
Is there any different in your setup, are you running an unmodified 2.51? One thing about your screenshot is that it shows the Rahanas really close to the station relative to its initial position on the load so it does make sense that in your successful case the Rahanas launched its cargolifters because it was close enough. In my game though the Rahanas never maneuvers that close to the station and trying to divine how I might convince it to do that is pointless. But I am encouraged that you managed to do that.
1. Tagging a few containers I want, move to the Rahanas - Rahanas is never as close to the station as in your screenshot. Although it does appear to be maneuvering around maybe trying to get closer, when I fly back to it then it stops moving and never releases drones.
2. Tagging a few containers I want and hiding in station nearby to give the Rahanas time to maneuver. In this case my Rahanas decided it wanted to maneuver around and ended up farther away from the containers when the containers started to explode.
Now I did not try tagging all the containers because I do not want all the containers, so I am hoping that is not a requirement. Although the extra time spent tagging might have given the Rahanas more time to maneuver hiding in the station didn't achieve similar results, so I am at a loss.
Is there any different in your setup, are you running an unmodified 2.51? One thing about your screenshot is that it shows the Rahanas really close to the station relative to its initial position on the load so it does make sense that in your successful case the Rahanas launched its cargolifters because it was close enough. In my game though the Rahanas never maneuvers that close to the station and trying to divine how I might convince it to do that is pointless. But I am encouraged that you managed to do that.
I am running a vanilla game. Lets cover the basics first, you need to be in cargo collect mode to release the cargolifter drones and for your support ship to get close to you, something that is present in your savegame, you can tag the wares, but if you disable cargo collect mode nothing will happen, this is crucial, your ship will only release cargolifters when cargo collect is enabled, you can always enable cargo collect mode again and your support ship will release the drones. Your problem may be cancelling the cargo collect mode because station is hostile and the risk of police and station scanning, so try flying out to your ship and enable cargo collect mode again.
A por ellos que son pocos y cobardes
Hello santi, thank you for your helpful suggestions. Unfortunately, in no test did I ever turn off cargo collect mode. Strangely enough distance may not be a factor in the test, since in another place I was able to get the Rahanas to launch a cargo lifter from the opposite end of the zone. I am starting to wonder if tagging every container was a trigger. I'm going to have to go test that next.
Okay, there is something too this. I need to test it more, but I was able to get it to work by tagging a ton of containers. It makes me think that the trigger might be tagging as many containers as you have cargolifters. Or possibly it could be that you have to tag enough cargo containers to fill up the hold.
If that is true, then it explains why tagging 1 lone container works always even causing your frieghter to drop a cargolifter from 20km away, but when there are 60-70 containers you need to tag a whole bunch of containers to get it to start. In my case I have 50 cargo lifters on my Rahanas so if the trigger is based on cargolifter count then I would have to tag at least 50 of the containers to get it to start.
Then the defect is that the rules of cargo collection aren't clear enough to be intuitive to normal gameplay.. After all if you have 60-70 containers mostly filled with ore and a dozen or so filled nividum cubes and reinforced steel plate, do you really want to tag that ore? You could fill your cargo bay with ore and end up losing out on reinforced steel plate. If the trigger is based on cargolifter count then reducing the number of cargolifters in my rahanas to 20 or so should make this problem easier to deal with.
Suggestion
If any of this turns out to be true and is "by design" then my suggestion to the devs would be to consider adding some sort of counter or collection mode mission objective to help guide the player in cases where the cargo collection may not start until certain counts have been achieved.
Like: Mission objective: Tag 50 crates
If that is true, then it explains why tagging 1 lone container works always even causing your frieghter to drop a cargolifter from 20km away, but when there are 60-70 containers you need to tag a whole bunch of containers to get it to start. In my case I have 50 cargo lifters on my Rahanas so if the trigger is based on cargolifter count then I would have to tag at least 50 of the containers to get it to start.
Then the defect is that the rules of cargo collection aren't clear enough to be intuitive to normal gameplay.. After all if you have 60-70 containers mostly filled with ore and a dozen or so filled nividum cubes and reinforced steel plate, do you really want to tag that ore? You could fill your cargo bay with ore and end up losing out on reinforced steel plate. If the trigger is based on cargolifter count then reducing the number of cargolifters in my rahanas to 20 or so should make this problem easier to deal with.
Suggestion
If any of this turns out to be true and is "by design" then my suggestion to the devs would be to consider adding some sort of counter or collection mode mission objective to help guide the player in cases where the cargo collection may not start until certain counts have been achieved.
Like: Mission objective: Tag 50 crates
Re: 2.51 - Cargo container collection issue [WORKAROUND FOUND]
I'm confused as to why you would think this type of behaviour isn't a bug. It certainly wouldn't be intended.......zanzal wrote: I've confirmed this is not a bug. Cargo collection mode just doesn't work well if you have too many cargolifters on your freighter. This is because you have to tag a number of crates equal to your cargolifters to get the process to begin.
To the devs: This behavior although not a bug is completely unintuitive
From my perspective, I would classify this behavior as a design flaw. Cargo collection works once you know the rules that the game engine is using to start the process. The rules aren't obvious though and there is no guidance to address that. Also the rules prohibit you from selectively salvaging only the stuff you want. A related problem is how to get rid of unwanted cargo after salvaging. I ended up having to sell the ship because I couldn't find buyers for the cargo I looted and I couldn't find a way to drop the cargo.