[POLL] Would you use Steam for Rebirth?

[Roger L.S. Griffiths]

@eladan: CBJ has already warned us about continuing the topic of copy protection, but I will say this: the Steam client is not DRM in itself (a subtle point I know but it is true none the less) - it is an internet based gaming service which provides desirable features for the publisher and gamer alike. Some of those features are exclusive to multiplayer games, but a significant portion of them are not.

Just because you can not see the added value does not mean it is not there.

[EDIT]The requirement for an internet connection is a general requirement of the Steam service before DRM is even considered.[/EDIT]

[CBJ]

Since everyone seems to think they should get the last word, despite my warning, this thread is now locked. It will be unlocked again when people have got the message and understood that when we say the subject is off limits, we mean it. Meanwhile any other Steam threads that get started will be locked without further warning.

[CBJ]

And unlocked again. If people continue to ignore moderator warnings, a future lock may be permanent.

[eladan]

... And there is zero point to a continuing discussion, since one of the central issues to "Will you use steam" isn't allowed to be mentioned.

Might as well lock it again, CBJ.

[CBJ]

It may be the only issue you are interested in discussing, but others may feel differently. The moderators will decide when threads get locked.

[Slashman]

[CBJ]

The reasons are long-standing and have been explained on numerous occasions. Now I suggest any further discussion of moderator actions takes place by PM, as per the forum rules. I should warn you, though, that I have very little time to further repeat things that I have already repeated many, many times.

[Night Nord]

DRM discussion is irrelevant to Steam.

Let's break down "Steam problem" into smaller parts:

1) DRM. You may be against or for any DRM, or you may support/oppose particular types of DRM, but that's DRM discussion. It's discussion about particular algorithms, methods and philosiphy behind it. It's not discussion about implementation. So, discussing Steam in view of DRM is just ineffective - you should discuss DRM (not here, obviously) in wider view - that way you'll get more arguments/stronger arguments.

As CBJ said, this discussion is off-limits. I dunno why, but hey - he's a moderator.

2) Online distribution replacing retail distribution. That's about fear that one day there will be no more retail distribution or retail discs will be just cache installers for digital distribution platforms. Sure, it will, but again - that's a discussion about general tendency on market and not about one particular implementation of online distribution. Steam could be an example, but not a culprit.

Also, I do believe that such switch is inevitable (retail -> digital). So question remains only about particular method of digital distribution. Is it mere e-shop - you'd payed your money, you downloaded your archive with game. Like is active for some period of time and then it will expire (you are expected to store your archive on disc yourself) (my opinion - that way is sure fail. We have a few example already. People do expect Steam-like service from online distribution now. That was one of the initial problems of EA's Origin). Or it is full-featured user-oriented service like Steam ("ecosystem"), where games are just component of the service not the result.

That's a one topic for discussion. What model do you prefer and why?

3) Particular problems of particular implementation - lack of/too much restricted offline mode (that's not a DRM, more technical implementation of authentication protocols coming from the fact that Steam is a service-around-games, not a service-delivering-games thing), slow, heavy, bad pricing policy, bad support, bad forums, bad logo, bad style, whatever else you don't like in Steam as application.

That's technical problems and sure we may discuss them as well.

4) In case you dislike Steam in particular by any of points above, let's discuss how much people are sharing your point of view and if it's viable for developers to support such people like you or not.

So, you see, there is still more points to discuss than a simple DRM holywar.

[eladan]

@Night Nord, 2 and 3 would in theory be alleviated by the fact that even though Egosoft are distributing via steam, I am extremely confident there will be a boxed edition. Unfortunately, that boxed edition will also require steam, even though all the files are available on the disk.

Guess what's stopping those people from playing the game, even when they have all the files they need? Once more, it's down to that Three-Letter-Acronym-That-Shall-Not-Be-Spoken.

[Sibilantae]

[elexis]

Well look at the other side...

Lets say Egosoft release a boxed version and it doesn't have steam on it, it can be installed as is. I, Mr Hypothetical, like steam and more importantly I like the achievements and deadisdead mode that the steam version offers. Egosoft would accommodate me by letting register on steam using the serial key in my box, except that means that I now have to download the whole thing again despite the game being on disk in front of me.*

So if I buy the box and it has steam, then what I am buying is saving me the time and bandwidth of the initial download.
If I buy the box and it doesn't have steam then I am buying the box with a useless disk and a slip of paper with letters on it that lets me download the contents of the disc again.

Either way results in a lot of inconvenience to some people.

*if I was supertechsavvy I could negate a lot of the required download files but there will still be some.

[Kor'ah]

After three threads and a few thousand posts the horse is now extra dead.

Economics and a streamlined updating procedure won out in the end. It just doesn't make sense supporting two different versions of the game for the same platform when one of those versions is projected to be used by a small minority. Those users with sub-1MB connections, unreliable connections and/or ridiculously low data caps are the ones really losing out with a "Steam Only" release.

[squirrelrider]

Last time I read this thread was 1.5 years ago, and I actually read the same thing as the last posts.
Please lock this loop of hell thread.

[Sibilantae]

[santi]

Not sure If posted before, but another development team going for it.

http://www.bistudio.com/english/company/developers-blog/356-arma3-steam-dev-blog