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Cycrow
Moderator (Script&Mod)
Joined: 15 Nov 2004
Posts: 19862 on topic
Location: London
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 Posted: Fri, 5. Jun 09, 17:21 Post subject: |
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| arcana75 wrote: |
| mrbadger wrote: |
| arcana75 wrote: |
If I'm not wrong, this is a convenient GUI to basically move savegames around.
There are 2 PC games called Oblivion and Morrowind and back then there was a Plugin Manager tool for both. The neat thing about that was it was able to not only manage saves, it could detect the mods installed for the savegame and install/uninstall said mods when the savegame is loaded.
Worth considering for this tool with TC scripts and mods against saves. U might want to work with Cycrow to see if both the Plugin Manager and this tool can be combined for ultimate effect. |
I'm not sure I want to include script/mod support. The whole idea is that this utility is only involved with managing the savegame set of people who have multiple games on the go, regardless of whether those games are vanilla, mods, or scripts.
Also, alas it seems that Cycrow has lost the source for the Plugin Manager, so its going to be some time before that particuler tool gets updated. |
Actually it's not that difficult, considering that the default scripts are all named !***.pck and the t files are only a few specific filenames (0002-L0XX.pck and 0002.pck). Since the scripts run regardless of savegame, as long as they reside in the scripts folder, then ur program need only copy out all the non !***.pck files to go with the saves and copy them back when necessary. U can do this without Cycrow's help too. |
this would only work switching between modded and vanilla games. But scripts isn't the only files that you need to do it with.
Besides, the current plugin manager has a profile system that allows you to assign mods and package to a certain profile and it will control save games for that profile.
so if you player multiple mods, you can create a profile for each mod. So each profile will get a seperate set of save games
there really is no easy way to determine what scripts are for what packages, and what are modified and what are not, and what are being used in a saved game.
but then, script files are never really a problem for saved games anyways, so its alot of effort for no noticable benefit. Its the actual mod files that matter for saved games.
for a simple addition to work with mods, you could just assign each "group" of save games to a mod file from the x3tc/mods directory.
then when you active the group, it simply activates the mod thats been set.
all you need for this is to get the .cat list from /mods to select, and edit the registery setting for the mod name
_________________
My Scripts | MY X3TC Scripts | X3 Plugin Manager | Custom Gui |
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mrbadger
Moderator (English)
Joined: 28 Oct 2005
Posts: 5576 on topic
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| Posted: Fri, 5. Jun 09, 17:40 Post subject: |
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| Cycrow wrote: |
for a simple addition to work with mods, you could just assign each "group" of save games to a mod file from the x3tc/mods directory.
then when you active the group, it simply activates the mod thats been set.
all you need for this is to get the .cat list from /mods to select, and edit the registery setting for the mod name |
This must be a definition of the word 'simple' I wasn't aware of 
Well I might be able to do it, if its not that hard (I know nothing about scripts and mods). Not yet though, I think the savegame manager needs to mature a bit first. I've already got a list of things I want to add.
If you wanted to help add it, I'd be ok with that. Provided you resisted the temptation to start twitching when you saw my code...
Thinking about it, I'd probably write a second version for use by people who run mods, and keep the normal version as it is, just for savegames.
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I have had my results for a long time: but I do not yet know how I am to arrive at them.
~Karl Friedrich Gauss |
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Cycrow
Moderator (Script&Mod)
Joined: 15 Nov 2004
Posts: 19862 on topic
Location: London
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| Posted: Fri, 5. Jun 09, 18:30 Post subject: |
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well the "Simple" i was thinking of was to totally ignore scripts, and just focus on the full mods.
these are cat/file files that are in the mods directory.
only 1 of these can be activated at one time, and these are listed on the TC Startup screen, when you goto Select Mod Package.
all u'll need to do, is assign the file name of the mod to the group of save games.
Assuming you only have 1 X3TC Directory, you get the available mod list by getting the filenames of mods/*.cat
in Begin New Compaign, you could have an additional drop down box or listbox with the available mods and default to the option "Vanilla" so you link the compaign to a mod file
something like
| Quote: |
Choose a Campaign Name
___________________
Link to Mod Package
Vanilla______\/
Enter a Compaign Decrition
______________________
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when the compaign is activated, just adjust the registry value for modname to match the filename of the selected mod
HKCU/Software/Egosoft/X3TC/modName
then when the game is run, the mod will automatically be selected and loaded into the game.
Just an idea if you wanted to add some limited mod support.
i havn't actually done java in quite a few years, so my knowledge on it is limited.
its pretty easy to do it in something like QT thou, so i assume it should be doable with java, but u might need to use an additional library for registry access
_________________
My Scripts | MY X3TC Scripts | X3 Plugin Manager | Custom Gui |
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mrbadger
Moderator (English)
Joined: 28 Oct 2005
Posts: 5576 on topic
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| Posted: Fri, 5. Jun 09, 18:45 Post subject: |
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Ok thanks, thats useful.
I'm still new to Java myself (well I say new, I did teach it for a term, but that was just to first year students, so it was pretty simple stuff). I predominantly use C/C++ for everything (usually C), but I had to use Java for a research project recently, so I decided to use it for this to give me some more practice.
I'll look into adding mod support. There are a few things to sort/add first.
_________________
I have had my results for a long time: but I do not yet know how I am to arrive at them.
~Karl Friedrich Gauss |
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Nanook
Moderator (English)
Joined: 15 May 2003
Posts: 22544 on topic
Location: In the X-Universe spanning two millenia
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| Posted: Fri, 5. Jun 09, 19:06 Post subject: |
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| Cycrow wrote: |
well the "Simple" i was thinking of was to totally ignore scripts, and just focus on the full mods.
these are cat/file files that are in the mods directory.
only 1 of these can be activated at one time, and these are listed on the TC Startup screen, when you goto Select Mod Package.
all u'll need to do, is assign the file name of the mod to the group of save games.
Assuming you only have 1 X3TC Directory, you get the available mod list by getting the filenames of mods/*.cat... |
Except it's not really that simple. Some people run multiple mods using false patches. Others use scripts that don't use your plugin manager. The popular MARS scripts come to mind. And if you start a new game with those scripts or mods in their assigned game folders, you get those mods/scripts whether you want them or not. The only way I've found around this issue is to have multiple instances of the game for each set of mods/scripts I want to run. But even that gets messy at times.
I really wish Egosoft wouldn't have moved all the saves and screenshot folders to the My Documents directory, and simply left them in the main game folder as in the past. They could've put them in savegame and screenshot subdirectories. Or better yet, let the players choose an appropriate spot for them. That way, they could still cater to those who don't want to run the game as an administrator (default could still be My Documents, I guess) as well as those that want more control. So at the start of each new game, you could choose a new savegame folder and give it a distinctive name.
For that matter, there's no reason no to be able to do that in the My Documents folder, too. For a game about choices, we have precious few when it comes to the 'important' decisions. 
_________________
Having an Acronym Attack? See the Ego FAQ. Also now for Terran Conflict. |
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mrbadger
Moderator (English)
Joined: 28 Oct 2005
Posts: 5576 on topic
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| Posted: Fri, 5. Jun 09, 20:17 Post subject: |
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From my point of view its easier to have the single savegame folder.
That meant I could ignore the fact that someone might have any number of installs, and just provide the ability to move the relevent savegames in and out of the savegame folder as the user wants.
Move in the right savegame set, load the correct X3:TC install, and its ready to go.
Of course, without the automated 'activation' and storage of sets of savegames, one savegame folder would be a pain. That's most of the reason why I decided to write this thing in the first place.
_________________
I have had my results for a long time: but I do not yet know how I am to arrive at them.
~Karl Friedrich Gauss |
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Nanook
Moderator (English)
Joined: 15 May 2003
Posts: 22544 on topic
Location: In the X-Universe spanning two millenia
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| Posted: Fri, 5. Jun 09, 21:17 Post subject: |
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| mrbadger wrote: |
| From my point of view its easier to have the single savegame folder..... |
As it currently stands, I agree. I was just bemoaning the fact that Egosoft didn't give us a flexible savegame option already built in. The ability to choose/create a savegame folder with each new gamestart really should have been available from the very beginning. It would have made all this extra work unnecessary. But your work addressing the issue is much appreciated.
And while I'm bemoaning, I don't understand why Egosoft got rid of half the savegame slots. It's not like having those extra slots was ever controversial, or caused anyone problems. And for those of us who liked to use them all, the current situation seems like another step backwards. Oh, well. 
_________________
Having an Acronym Attack? See the Ego FAQ. Also now for Terran Conflict. |
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GrahamAtome
Joined: 24 Mar 2004
Posts: 75 on topic
Location: watford
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| Posted: Fri, 5. Jun 09, 22:42 Post subject: |
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I'm just glad that it does what it says on the tin 
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mrbadger
Moderator (English)
Joined: 28 Oct 2005
Posts: 5576 on topic
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| Posted: Sat, 6. Jun 09, 00:51 Post subject: |
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| GrahamAtome wrote: |
| I'm just glad that it does what it says on the tin |
I'm glad you helped me test it, that saved a lot of time.
_________________
I have had my results for a long time: but I do not yet know how I am to arrive at them.
~Karl Friedrich Gauss |
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BDStyle
Joined: 30 Sep 2004
Posts: 808 on topic
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| Posted: Sat, 6. Jun 09, 02:03 Post subject: |
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Thank you to MrBadger and the testing guys for the work put into this. I shal be using it the next time I fire up the game. I currently have 3 campaigns running and being able to switch between them is great. specially becuase I use the campaign description section to make a short note of tasks I was in the middle of (important for my no rules, everything goes game where I have a sprawling empire).
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arcana75
Joined: 02 Dec 2003
Posts: 2156 on topic
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| Posted: Sat, 6. Jun 09, 03:43 Post subject: |
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| mrbadger wrote: |
| arcana75 wrote: |
Actually it's not that difficult, considering that the default scripts are all named !***.pck and the t files are only a few specific filenames (0002-L0XX.pck and 0002.pck). Since the scripts run regardless of savegame, as long as they reside in the scripts folder, then ur program need only copy out all the non !***.pck files to go with the saves and copy them back when necessary. U can do this without Cycrow's help too. |
Not that difficult, says the guy who wouldn't have to code it
There is no way to tell what scripts are in use by what savegame, which is the main reason it can't be done.
Yes, new games could be started where the scripts are known, but that won't suit people with games they've already started.
Using the current plugin manager with my utility side by side would do what you want already. |
I say it's not difficult cuz I'm also a coder and designer and roughly know what can and cannot be done in code (or at least I think so!)
No offense intended.
The easy thing about scripts is, if it's in the scripts folder, it's gonna run, regardless of what savegame u have. If u were playing a modified game and copy in a vanilla game while a setup.script.file were in the scripts folder, say byebye to ur vanilla game as now it becomes modified due to the errant file.
To check for what scripts are in what save, u don't scan the savegame, u scan the scripts folder and as described earlier any file not named "!***.pck" is potentially in the savegame and should be removed when a new "campaign" is copied in.
Don't worry about it anyway, think everyone's happy the way things are now.
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Nanite Hull Repair, Resource-Free Factory, Collect Wares Mk 2, Remove Products from Docks, Hack Station |
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mrbadger
Moderator (English)
Joined: 28 Oct 2005
Posts: 5576 on topic
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| Posted: Sat, 6. Jun 09, 09:31 Post subject: |
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| arcana75 wrote: |
I say it's not difficult cuz I'm also a coder and designer and roughly know what can and cannot be done in code (or at least I think so!)
No offense intended. |
None taken
Although if you think everything thats asked for can be done, you've obviously never had a Ph.D supervisor
I'm mainly unwilling because I'm not a script/mod using player, so it would be coding for something about which I have no experience, and which, once written, wouldn't be something I'd use myself. That's fine for commercial stuff I guess, but not for a personal project. Cycrow has pointed out that mod support would be possible, although following Nanooks comment, it looks like it would be a very complex task.
This places it in the 'possible, but not terribly likely' catagory, at least where I'm concerned. Perhaps in the future someone else might use my code as a base to attempt it. For now I'll just continue to improve the savegame manager.
_________________
I have had my results for a long time: but I do not yet know how I am to arrive at them.
~Karl Friedrich Gauss |
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arcana75
Joined: 02 Dec 2003
Posts: 2156 on topic
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| Posted: Sat, 6. Jun 09, 10:55 Post subject: |
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| mrbadger wrote: |
| arcana75 wrote: |
I say it's not difficult cuz I'm also a coder and designer and roughly know what can and cannot be done in code (or at least I think so!)
No offense intended. |
None taken
Although if you think everything thats asked for can be done, you've obviously never had a Ph.D supervisor |
I lead a team of devs so I suspect they're thinking the same thing u are
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Nanite Hull Repair, Resource-Free Factory, Collect Wares Mk 2, Remove Products from Docks, Hack Station |
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mrbadger
Moderator (English)
Joined: 28 Oct 2005
Posts: 5576 on topic
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| Posted: Sat, 6. Jun 09, 13:47 Post subject: |
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Update
I've decided to overhaul the campaign comment text section. That was originally added just as an afterthought, but I've decided to turn it into a proper 'pilots log' thing, with a default log entry template, plus the ability for users to define their own log entry template.
As the weather is rotten My plans for today involve sitting in and coding, so I expect to have the first testing version available by this evening.
- MrBadger
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I have had my results for a long time: but I do not yet know how I am to arrive at them.
~Karl Friedrich Gauss |
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cyberfuzzie
Joined: 21 Nov 2006
Posts: 58 on topic
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| Posted: Sat, 6. Jun 09, 17:08 Post subject: |
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Sounds good.
I think, a "launch game"-button would be nice
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