[Ship mini mod] M6 Pocket Destroyers (Updated: 03-10-08)

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Mergelsberg
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[Ship mini mod] M6 Pocket Destroyers (Updated: 03-10-08)

Post by Mergelsberg » Sat, 19. Apr 08, 20:28

Introduction:
I posted this a few days ago on the Dutch forum and after some tweaking decided to also post it here.
A couple of weeks ago I bought my first M6, trying to figure out how it was intended and playing the rocket barge and having my wingmen crash into me at the most annoying of times, I figured I'd enjoy my M6 more if it was different.
I was struggling with targets that proved to be no problem at all for my Nova Vanguard. So feeling all brave and "I know better than you" I dove into the Ship Creator (for which many thanks to Cycrow) and set about 'rebalancing' the M6 class.

The point of the exercise was to make the M6 from a ship that's far more vulnerable than it looks and a lot less powerful than you'd expect into something that I felt better suited the size and cost of the ship.
Basically turning them into ships that are significantly more powerful and a lot tougher. Removing the need to spend heaps of Cr on missiles and torpedoes and removing the need to have an escort wing with you at all times.
Making the M6 into a proper Pocket Destroyer. Good straight line speed, slightly less oil-barge-esque steering and a weapon loadout that fits with a small capital class ship.

Updates:
  • 22-04-08: Added the Xenon P to the package, new stats added to this post.
  • 24-04-08: Drastically tuned down the Laser Recharge. None of the ships, even during prolonged sustained fire from ALL weapons would not drain any significant energy from the ships.
  • 03-10-08: I've removed the gPSG from the Nemesis and Osprey and replaced them with aFLAK. I've changed the turrets on the Hydra and Nemesis to be double barrelled so those can now mount 2 aFLAKs at the rear. Also I've increased the maximum cargo on the Nemesis and Dragon, so they can now accommodate a full weapons load while keeping some room for missiles, drones and jump fuel.
Notes:
  • So far I have only added the M6s that occur "naturally in the wild", I will add the Nemesis and Osprey variants in following updates.
  • I have not taken the M7 into account. So honestly I have no idea how it would compare to my rebalanced M6s, but as far as I know, these M6 will probably put the M7 to shame.
  • Laser Energy and Recharge Rate may need some more tweaking, I'm open to suggestions here.
  • You get nothing for free from this, I did not change base stats for any ship. Bar the much bigger Laser Energy pool you will have to buy all the new upgrades yourself.
  • The new stats will partially overwrite the old ones on existing ships, but will only work entirely with newly spawned ships. So if you already own an M6, you will need to buy a new one to replace it to get all the new stats.
  • The Xenon P has received a lesser upgrade in Laser Recharge than other ships. Giving the full Recharge upgrade to the P would mean infinite Laser Energy even when using 8 bHEPT.
  • The Xenon P has received a lesser number of Rudder Tunings in the upgrade than the other ships. Rudder Tunings on the P are on a completely different scale compared to the other M6, it's turning rate does gain a significant amount with the extra Rudder Tunings.
That being said, I'm open to any constructive criticism, opinions and advice. This is the first time I've fiddled with the game balance like this, so I wouldn't be surprised if I missed things or completely misjudged things.
Well on to business.

Weapon Upgrades:
I feel that it's appropriate for the M6, being described as a small capital ship, to bear weapons that are for capital ships. I also made some additional tweaks which I found to be logical in this light.
(weapons marked with * are only in some turrets, they are not in the main laser array. the same goes the other way, unmarked weapons are only in the main laser array, not in the turrets)
Weapons I've added:
  • Centaur: aPPC, aFLAK*, bPSG*
  • Dragon: bPPC, aFLAK*, TB*
  • Hydra: aPPC, aFLAK*, bPSG* rear turret upgraded to 2 barrels
  • Nemesis: aPPC, aFLAK*, TB* rear turret upgraded to 2 barrels
  • Osprey: aPPC, aFLAK*
  • P: bPPC
Engine and Rudder Tuning
I raised the maximum top speed by increasing the amount of engine tunings. This way I raised the top speeds about 50%. I gave the same treatment to the rudder tunings, which in turn adds about a 50% increase to steering (eg. max 9% becomes 13%, not 59%,) I haven't got exact numbers on the steering, so I'm leaving those out of the list for the moment.
I know these speeds may seem really high, but it's really just straight line speed. There is no way a M6 will suddenly out turn an M3, most M4s and M5s will still out run you even in a straight line.
New top speeds:
  • Centaur: 157m/s
  • Dragon: 218m/s
  • Hydra: 184m/s
  • Nemesis: 172m/s
  • Osprey: 121m/s
  • P: 204m/s
Laser Energy and Recharge Rate
I got these numbers pretty much at random. They seem appropriate to me, though they might be some what on the high side. I took the Comparison between a Centaur and a Titan, figuring I'd want the Centaur to have about 25-30% of the power that the Titan has.
In general the recharge from 0% to 100% takes about 80 seconds, it was like this per default and I haven't changed that ratio.
The new Laser Energy and Recharge Rates:
  • Centaur: 84kJ @ 1048J/s
  • Dragon: 125.6kJ @ 1568J/s
  • Hydra: 56kJ @ 700J/s
  • Nemesis: 92kJ @ 1148J/s
  • Osprey: 84kJ @ 1048J/s
  • P: 80kJ @ 1000J/s
Shield Strength and Shield Generators
I was kinda annoyed at there being TS and M3s that could rival an M6 in shielding. The difference in nature and size of these ships made me feel that the M6 class should have considerably more shielding.
New Shield Strength and Shield Generators:
  • Centaur: 7x 125MJ @ 7500MW
  • Dragon: 5x 125MJ @ 6450MW
  • Hydra: 1x 1GJ @ 8550MW
  • Nemesis: 7x 125MJ @ 7500MW
  • Osprey: 1x 1GJ @ 7950MW
  • P: 5x 125MJ @ 9000MW
Cargo Bays
The Cargo Bays on the Nemesis and Dragon were insufficient to fit even a single loadout of weapons and shields. Any station that sells Cargo Bay Extentions will now sell the new amount.
  • Dragon: 1060 units max
  • Nemesis: 750 units max

Hull Points
I wasn't sure how Hull Points in the editor would translate into the game, hence I left them alone. Also since the actual ship hasn't changed it's more canon in a way to leave the Hull Points as they are.


Download and Install
All ships are in XSP format, made with Cycrow's Ship Creator and install with Cycrow's X Plugin Manager.I've packaged it into a rar archive which can be found here.
The rebalanced ships will overwrite the original ones from Vanilla X3 and so far that hasn't given me any trouble. Also NPC ships will use the new upgrades.
If you already own M6 class ships, you will most likely have to replace them (eg. sell and buy a new one) for all the changes to be correctly applied.
If you already have a previous update of this mod, it may be required to remove all gPSG weapons from current Nemesis and Osprey ships that you may own. I don't give any sort of guarantee that your game won't crash if you do not remove them. During testing it did crash my game, so you have been warned.
Last edited by Mergelsberg on Sat, 11. Oct 08, 19:24, edited 7 times in total.

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Carlo the Curious
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Post by Carlo the Curious » Sat, 19. Apr 08, 20:38

I have only modified the player buyable M6s. I haven't yet gotten around to the Xenon P, because I didn't realise I could have spawned one with the cheat scripts when I did this. I'm open to suggestions on what to do with the P, as it will have to be rebalanced in order to keep balance in the game.
Bear in mind that some of the M6 variants (e.g. Nemesis Vanguard) are also obtainable by players, so you may want to modify those as well (if you haven't already).

Personally I think those modifications make them a little too fast and powerful (e.g. a Dragon is faster than a Mamba Raider), but that's just me :).

shilhi
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Post by shilhi » Sat, 19. Apr 08, 20:50

I think this sounds pretty nifty. :wink:
Im gonna give it a go. I was always annoyed at how pathetic the M6's were. I have many sectors now thanks to the Sector take over script, and I have to continually defend them.

As you know, the races sectors that I conquered aren't very happy with my invading fleets, or my defense fleets I have in their, er, my sectors. :D Every single time I hear the ship computer warning me that I have ships under attack, I see a destroyed M6 in my KIA list. :shock:

Again, thanks for this.

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Post by dalin80 » Sat, 19. Apr 08, 22:02

Top speeds may be a bit too high, sure its more fun that way but when small capital ships are overtaking light fighters there could be the odd raised eyebrow.

Some time ago I set about trying to improve the M6's too and found that a bit more subtle tweaking doubled there usefulness. I also added in two versions of every M6 for a bit more choice.

-All M6's were given 10% top speed
-All M6's were given 1% more rudder
-Hydra rudder increased 2%
-All bar osprey were given 1 extra shield slot
-osprey was given 1x1gj shield (added a sentinel version with 2x1gj but 2/3rd top speed)
-All hull points raised 20% (centaur and osprey 40%)
-All energy reserves increased 15% (25% for vanguard variants)
-Added (as you did) some capability for some turrets to hold Aflak and APPC.
-Added a Centaur Freighter (2x cargo 1.25x hull 0.75x energy recharge 0.75x energy reserve A class weapons only)

This works for me its just a matter of finding a balance that each person is happy with.

The M6's were too weak from the off, if memory serves Ego patched them up a tiny bit from 'completely and totally laughable' to 'still pretty pathetic' then the M3+'s were introduced making the M6 completely redundant. I use XTM as well and my changes also effect the enemy M6's so in some cases its made the game a bit harder, the xenon P raider is quite a challenge to knock out in a m4 now.

Heres to hoping that Ego give them there testicles back for TC.
Pilot of the Purple Elephant

shilhi
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Post by shilhi » Sat, 19. Apr 08, 22:11

Uh, lol. I dont know how to install it. I tryed just about everything I could think of, and nothing. Could someone help me?

ps. I tryed it with the NH mod and Original X3.

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Mergelsberg
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Post by Mergelsberg » Sat, 19. Apr 08, 22:40

Carlo the Curious wrote:Bear in mind that some of the M6 variants (e.g. Nemesis Vanguard) are also obtainable by players, so you may want to modify those as well (if you haven't already).
I'll look into that, thanks for pointing it out :)
Just checked the Model Viewer, which shows a Nemesis Raider as being "not buyable" and 2 other Nemesis and 3 Osprey variants as being "not in game". So if I'd add the Nemesis Raider and the Xenon P, I'd have covered all relevant ships then? Or should I extend this overhaul to include the two "argon" Plot related M6s too, the True Light Seeker and that 'unknown ship' one?

Personally I think those modifications make them a little too fast and powerful (e.g. a Dragon is faster than a Mamba Raider), but that's just me :).
I have thought about this, but in the end I came to the conclusion that despite being able to outrun an M3 you still have no hope in hell of out turning it.
I have 'tested' most with my Centaur, and while at 157m/s I can catch up with a Nova Raider I need to dramatically slow down to bring any of my bHEPT and aPPC power to bear. The speed is a straight line thing, the turning radius at speed is measured in kilometres, almost.



Edit: Shili you need the X Plugin Manager from Cycrow, which is linked in the sticky.
Then it's a simple matter of unpacking the rar and double clicking the XSP files and enabling them.

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Carlo the Curious
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Post by Carlo the Curious » Sat, 19. Apr 08, 23:46

Mergelsberg wrote:Just checked the Model Viewer, which shows a Nemesis Raider as being "not buyable" and 2 other Nemesis and 3 Osprey variants as being "not in game". So if I'd add the Nemesis Raider and the Xenon P, I'd have covered all relevant ships then? Or should I extend this overhaul to include the two "argon" Plot related M6s too, the True Light Seeker and that 'unknown ship' one?
To be honest I'm not certain which are available except the Nemesis Vanguard (treasure hunt reward) - I seem to remember people reporting they'd got an Osprey variant as a reward as well.

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Post by shilhi » Sun, 20. Apr 08, 02:40

Mergelsberg wrote:
Edit: Shili you need the X Plugin Manager from Cycrow, which is linked in the sticky.
Then it's a simple matter of unpacking the rar and double clicking the XSP files and enabling them.
I am using the Plugin manager. Ingame when I go buy a M6 and check to see if theres a difference, there isnt one. Same old same old.

Am I just retarded or something? :?

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Post by beyer_garratt » Sun, 20. Apr 08, 03:08

Being a Centaur Pilot for most of my X career, and having a secret soft spot for the Dragon, I am very appreciative of this mod that you've produced.

In particular I approve of the extra shielding, which we all know to be quite pathetic vanilla.

One question: Has the ships' acceleration rate been modified? The idea of a Corvette that can go blisteringly fast but takes an age to get there really floats my boat, so to speak. :oops:
Q) What do you call an unimpressed Kha'ak scout?

A) A bemusa triangle!

Bazza's better PPC mod! - Makes flying a capital ship much more... satisfying.
Mergelsberg's Transport Drone & my own version. -M3 freighter for TL ships.

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Mergelsberg
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Post by Mergelsberg » Sun, 20. Apr 08, 03:54

shilhi wrote: I am using the Plugin manager. Ingame when I go buy a M6 and check to see if theres a difference, there isnt one. Same old same old.

Am I just retarded or something? :?
I must admit that I'm pretty new to modding X3, like I said above.

In my game when I look at the details of a Centaur in the Argon Prime SY it'll show the upgraded maximum shielding and other stats. Though it does not come with anything more than you'd get on the Vanilla one.
beyer_garratt wrote:One question: Has the ships' acceleration rate been modified? The idea of a Corvette that can go blisteringly fast but takes an age to get there really floats my boat, so to speak.
The accelleration rate is unchanged other than what the extra Engine Tunings add to it. So it'll be somewhat higher at full tunings than it used to be, but you won't be winning any prices at the drag strip.

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Post by defiant1 » Sun, 20. Apr 08, 05:44

hmmm a properly done pocket distroyer....not bad...I alreadyhave a fleet of 10 and they are growing fast....great work they seem to handel them selves well...
Teladi Next Minute Shipping®

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Ship mini mod

Post by parameter » Mon, 21. Apr 08, 18:06

Hi! I have always thought the missing gun platform was an Aflak! As you have stated it is a bit drippy having a wing of fighters to protect an M6 when it is supposedly a brute powerhouse of a light pocket destroyer. Obviously if it is towing or escorting lots of TS's then Fighters are needed.
veneratio supernus omni

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Mergelsberg
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Post by Mergelsberg » Tue, 22. Apr 08, 03:43

Glad to see you guys like it :)

I hope you'll like the Xenon P as well. I was provoking some other M6 with it to see how things would balance out and I'm really happy to see that M6 vs M6 combat has become much more intense.

Once the RRF M2s arrived I was done for though, never mind the 3 Military Centaurs happily spraying aPPC at my tail.

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Mergelsberg
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Post by Mergelsberg » Thu, 24. Apr 08, 20:19

Just uploaded a new version of mod, I've dramatically slashed the Laser Recharge on all ships. Hopefully this will give a better balance and will actually drain the energy reserves rather than these ships effectively having infinite energy.

Though at the moment it's really trial and error for me, so I'd love opinions and advice on the decrease in the recharge.

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Post by shilhi » Fri, 25. Apr 08, 04:37

Mergelsberg wrote:
I hope you'll like the Xenon P as well. I was provoking some other M6 with it to see how things would balance out and I'm really happy to see that M6 vs M6 combat has become much more intense.
Lol. like poking an alligator with a 6 inch stick. :lol:

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