[Final Fury Khaak 931 Assault] Ships don't stop spawning

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jacex3tc
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[Final Fury Khaak 931 Assault] Ships don't stop spawning

Post by jacex3tc » Sat, 7. Jul 18, 17:17

I'm doing Final Fury and I'm on the bit where the guy tells you to go to Khaak Sector 931 and blow some stuff up

Problem is, enemies don't stop respawning. I played this for about an hour, did 75% of Defender of the Universe and unlocked it, gained two fight ranks from fighter chief to militant, and gave it up there. Is there a fix?

these campaigns no bueno.

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Post by Alan Phipps » Sat, 7. Jul 18, 17:42

Moving to X Trilogy Universe (gameplay) forum as this isn't really a request for Tech Sp.

This is an extract from Spike's Op FF guide in the Guides Sticky:
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Your next tour of duty is in Kha’ak Sector 931, where scouts have reported a high concentration of Kha’ak ships amassing. Your mission is to destroy them before they get sent to wreak havoc in the Commonwealth. You will, of course, need a combat ship. Exactly what you fight depends on your ship and your fight rank, and there’s little guidance can be given for combat other than telling you that the bigger your ship and the higher your fight rank the more enemies you’ll get and the tougher they’ll be. Just let loose, usual combat tactics. You’ll have a small friendly force backing you up, and if things do start to go awry, jumping back to the centre of the Sector could leave you in clear air for long enough for your shields to regenerate.

There are several waves of Kha’ak ships, but once you and your team have destroyed the requisite number there is a congratulations call and a mission complete. Stick around if you like, but otherwise, you should head back to M148 for your next assignment, which will come through after the usual waiting period.
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Post by DrSuperEvil » Sat, 7. Jul 18, 18:50

Start the mission with an M5 and then send in an M2. Kha'ak are allergic to PPCs and PSGs.

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Post by jlehtone » Sat, 7. Jul 18, 19:44

I cannot remember that mission. However, I'm sure that I had read Spike's Guide beforehand and therefore prepared myself with Combat rank Xtreme and had at least M7 Panther, M1 Raptor, and M2 Python at my disposal. Alas, that did not, IMHO, yield what Spike implies. YMMV.

I did get PALC's to one side turret of Panther from some FF job. Was 931 before or after that point?


gPPC has longer range than any Kyon. A ship slightly faster than the Kha'ak Capitals can thus bombard them indefinitely without getting fired back.

What does cause attrition are the Kha'ak fighters. There are always some spawning near you in Kha'ak sector whether you are on a mission or not. Those may, or may not be counted towards "achievements". The PSG affect area and thus kill fighters with relative ease. Friends included.
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Post by Bill Huntington » Sat, 7. Jul 18, 19:46

Many of us are looking for fights like that. There's not enough of them. Thanks for the reminder!
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Post by SirNukes » Sat, 7. Jul 18, 21:43

As I recall, those missions have a specific group of ships they want you to destroy. The respawning ambient Khaak will bother you, but are not part of the mission. If you turn on guidance, I think it should highlight the nearest actual target.

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Post by jacex3tc » Sun, 8. Jul 18, 02:34

SirNukes wrote:As I recall, those missions have a specific group of ships they want you to destroy. The respawning ambient Khaak will bother you, but are not part of the mission. If you turn on guidance, I think it should highlight the nearest actual target.
I'm flying the Cerberus. Before that I tried with a TM and a couple M3's but it's too heavy for that and I didn't know you had backup but it wouldn't matter anyway.

The backup gets killed off after about half an hour.

The problem is those objective guys keep respawning. The game sometimes will change one of the ships around me to an objective ship, but more usually it picks a scout that's 20-30km away. I have to fly to it while constantly mashing j because of all the mobs constantly getting destroyed and respawning that are tailing me.

I played it for about an hour, about half of that at 10x SETA. It doesn't look like it's functioning properly.
DrSuperEvil wrote:Start the mission with an M5 and then send in an M2. Kha'ak are allergic to PPCs and PSGs.
I'll try this now.

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Post by SirNukes » Sun, 8. Jul 18, 04:10

I took a glance through the scripts ("2.02 Khaak Plot" and "0.8 Battle Enemy Ships"), and I think I see the problem. In short, the script logic isn't robust.

While the mission creates an initial group of ships for you to kill, as you kill them off the group list will get updated with all khaak ships nearby (within 60 km around the sector center), so any nearby respawning ships that hang out in that sector will get slurped into the objectives.

Since those ships respawn so fast, it can make the mission very difficult to complete, and one of the few comments in those scripts points out this fact. So, at the start of the mission, all of the pre-mission khaak ships in the sector get moved way away from the sector center, to be moved back when the mission completes.

This would, of course, fall apart if any of those khaak ships were dead and awaiting respawn when the mission was accepted, since they would respawn into the normal part of the sector and get added to the mission objectives. A similar problem would occur if the moved ships were still close enough to wander back toward the sector center. (The move command requests a 500 km distance but has a 40 km height clamp, so there might be an issue if the clamp is evaluated last.)


Some possible ideas on what to try:
  • Reload from before you accepted the mission, wait a little bit for dead ships to respawn, then try again.
  • Power through it and reach that distant scout; once you get in its sensor range it should hopefully turn towards you and save some time. If the only respawning ships are always warping in at your location, wiping them out one last time should finish the mission.
  • Warp in more of your ships, preferably heavies, to help chase down khaak.
  • Install the cheat package and use that to kill off the khaak ships in sector. (Tags the save as modified and disables achievements.)
  • Mod the game to crank up respawn times on khaak ships temporarily. (Also disables achievements.)

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Post by jacex3tc » Sun, 8. Jul 18, 10:07

So are you saying that the adds that spawn from just being in the sector are then saved and respawn? On top of new adds that spawn in all the time?

Based on what you're saying, I have a theory about what might be going on.

When I did the previous mission in this sector, the one where you scan the station, I went in there in a Kestrel. I hadn't even bought a capital ship before this mission. I only found out about the busted balance on this campaign after searching once I encountered the first Xenon fleet. I also discovered you can destroy a Q in an M4 if you have Mass Drivers.

So in the recon mission I used my Kestrel, and I was tooling around in that sector a little while. It must have spawned hundreds or thousands of ships. I just kited them all around. If they're all just still there then this might be impossible to do without cheats.
Reload from before you accepted the mission, wait a little bit for dead ships to respawn, then try again.
I didn't do this one soon after the previous one. I'm pretty sure enough time would have passed, but how long are we talking here? I'll probably shift back to the Hub campaign while I mull this one.
Power through it and reach that distant scout; once you get in its sensor range it should hopefully turn towards you and save some time. If the only respawning ships are always warping in at your location, wiping them out one last time should finish the mission.
I did that many times. It's not just close ones that it will pick, it more often pick something far away. When I played it most recently, the farthest ship to be marked was 50km away and flew to 60km before I started chasing after it. I can't just chase constantly because chasing causes me to not be able to stay ahead of the damage tailing ships are doing to my shields, meaning I have to turn around and fight adds for a while.
Warp in more of your ships, preferably heavies, to help chase down khaak.
I bought a Cerberus specifically for this and it's currently my only capital. I bought a Boron corvette after doing the Khaak mission before this one, for the next Hub mission. Up to now all I've been using are fighters and freighters.

This way of doing it is pretty stupid. That story sector should have been wiped and prepped before and after every story mission. At the very least, adds should have been cleaned at mission end when you dock back at M1438 or leave the sector.

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Post by DrSuperEvil » Sun, 8. Jul 18, 12:26

Is your Cerberus using CFA and PBCs? If you are going in solo consider a Paranid capital ship for the PSGs to shred fighters.

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Post by jacex3tc » Sun, 8. Jul 18, 16:23

I have a couple CFA on the front guns alongside four HEPT and two CIG. My broadsides are IBLs. I had intended to put two PBC with the IBLs but I don't know where the PBC are yet. Don't tell me. My top and bottom are a PRG and FAA. My back gun is a PRG and ID.

What I might do is just buy two or three M1s and plant them at the periphery of the the 60k and take a last corner. Not gonna do that right away though because I'm kind of sick of this mission right now. I'm currently playing the Goner missions.
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Can someone tell me something though without spoiling any individual details? I found something out while doing searches about this mission. When this campaign is finished, are you really have supposed to have destroyed the entire Khaak race? That's pretty brutal. Do they disappear from the game entirely?

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Post by jlehtone » Sun, 8. Jul 18, 19:42

No. Not entirely.
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Post by devilofbelfast » Mon, 9. Jul 18, 13:29

Consider another option, TL class Missile Bomber... 60k cargo space, decent missile selection, nice shields, nice guns, throw on an afterburner and a thousand drones for throwing out in batches on attack all enemies. You attack the indicated targets at range with swarm missiles while the drones distract everything.
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Post by DrSuperEvil » Mon, 9. Jul 18, 13:35

Here is a hint: Lasertower = PBC

It is not recommended to mix lasers since the turret turning is determined by the slowest laser and it messes with the automatic aiming.

Rather mix the ID with FBL or CFA since it can bounce to the projectiles of those weapons.

Personally I would go with some Paranid M2s since M1s lack the laser energy regen for heavy IS combat.

Kha'ak can still be found in the UFJD sector. Finishing that plot just stops the large raids on random sectors.

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Post by Alan Phipps » Mon, 9. Jul 18, 14:32

"It is not recommended to mix lasers since the turret turning is determined by the slowest laser and it messes with the automatic aiming."

The turret turning by slowest weapon issue is correct but different bullet types from the same turret/group will use different paths to impact with the target so the overall auto-aim function is not too adversely affected.

What is affected is that all weapons in that group start firing when the target in in range of and aligned by, the longest range weapon; so you may perhaps be wasting energy/ammo for the shorter ranged weapons.

Sometime even these 'issues' can become useful with an approaching or approached target. See here and here.

Charged shots can sometimes mess with aiming as the aim and trajectory is fixed at the point when you start charging and not at bullet release.
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Post by Triaxx2 » Mon, 9. Jul 18, 14:43

Three options: Get a missile ship. A Split Cobra, or Argon Minotaur are excellent options. Equip them with Flail Swarm missiles, and use the barrage command in the special menu to fire a single barrage into a swarm of Kha'ak ships. Any over kill missiles will pick new targets until they explode, or run out of fuel. Repeat as necessary. Commodity Logistics System from the bonus pack can be used to continually refresh your missile supply.

Option 2: Bring a carrier, either the Argon Colossus, or Split Raptor. Fill them with many cheap M4 fighters, and then fly through formations of Kha'ak. As long as the fighters are homebased to the carrier, they'll automatically launch once the carrier comes under attack.

Option 3: The Teladi Albatross, with Flak Artillery Array's in all it's slots, plus a cargobay full of drones. It will evaporate anything smaller than a corvette that gets close, and anything corvette or larger can be swarmed under by fighter drones. You'll lose them by the horde, but that's what they exist for. MkII's are more effective, but far more expensive.
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Post by Honved » Tue, 10. Jul 18, 22:44

A Cerberus makes a decent anti-fighter vessel, but is rather lack-luster against any capital ship, including the multiple Kha'ak Corvettes that you'll face.

A Paranid capital ship with Phased Shockwave Generators in all turrets acts like a giant "Pink Pet" eraser, and leaves a trail of absolutely nothing behind it: no ships, no stations, no salvage, no ejected survivors, no problem. Taking it into the middle of a Kha'ak fighter swarm just vaporizes everything. It's also very effective against capital ships, since overlapping forward PSGs will each hit multiple hit boxes simultaneously, doing massive damage as you close and then ram whatever little still remains (at least in TC, AP has much higher hull point values). You've got the shields to absorb it, theirs will be long gone by that point.

I did most the later FF missions with a Diemos, and the final mission was pretty much a cakewalk with it, although my fight rank was nowhere near extreme. At one point, I had to fly THROUGH one capital ship to get to the second sitting directly behind it, and rammed both in turn, leaving me with still over half shields. Individual ships after that were simply no match, and I was actually regaining shield strength throughout the rest of the mission.

You'll probably need an M2 at the higher Fight rank. As far as I know, the guide may be obsolete, and going in with a bigger ship may no longer affect the mission difficulty with the later game patches, while Fight Rank definitely still does. Too many players were cheesing missions by going in with a light fighter, then jumping their capital ships in after the minimal opposition spawned.

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Post by Imgran » Wed, 11. Jul 18, 21:11

I like to use the Deimos against fighter based threats too, but I hate putting PSG's in turrets because you have rather little control of when and where you turn on the blender.

And of course, using a Deimos in the blender configuration is a reputation nightmare. The answer to the question "will it blend?" is definitely "yes, unless it's a full sized asteroid" but the lack of control comes back to bite you unless you're quite careful. Frankly they're not really safe to fly around in that configuration, one little bump at the wrong time and you can wind up blenderizing an entire sector and losing several levels of reputation.

It's a stupendously powerful setup, but I prefer quite a bit more control over exactly what gets blended.

When flying a Deimos, I'll use front mounted PSGs and just put FAA's in the turrets. That still puts tons of fighters out of commission very quickly, with nowhere near the collateral damage. If I see a lot of fighters in a group, I'll release a controlled PSG burst to take it out. Otherwise my PSG is saved for stripping the shields of capitals and getting ready to ramp up shields and football tackle them for the win.
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Post by Honved » Thu, 12. Jul 18, 16:29

That's a fair assessment of the down sides of PSGs. I NEVER (let me repeat: NEVER) use PSGs in the turrets while in Terran or Commonwealth sectors, ONLY while in Xenon or Kha'ak space. The potential for collateral damage and "friendly fire" accidents is close to a guarantee. Still, when you need that kind of blatantly exaggerated mass-destruction capability for certain missions, it's only available on a few Paranid capital ships.

I will cheerfully place 2-4 PSGs in forward mounts (assigned to their own firing group), and use those against things like Kha'ak clusters or pirate swarms, as long as I'm aware of my surroundings and when I can and can't fire them. Kiling a Q with a Diemos is as simple as holding down the fire button and ramming, as the Q will have its shields stripped away by impact, and the Diemos has considerably more shield points than the Q has hull (in TC, not AP). Putting those same PSGs in a turret takes away any semblance of control or restraint, and "accidents" are all but inevitable.

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Post by jacex3tc » Thu, 19. Jul 18, 10:26

Tried again. Same crap. It never stops. I can get it to one ship and it will always just magic a new one. Just now I got it to a single Khaak fighter and I sent a corvette after it and I watched it take down my corvette (ok bro) and then 3 ships spawned.

What a joke that they bone your achievements in a game like this. Look at Skyrim. That can be buggy. I've needed to use cheats there to fix broken shit at times. It doesn't screw your save if you do.

I hope that they don't go overboard with X4 because they'll jankify that game too. It was a mistake to have Rebirth only have one ship to fly. It would have been better if it were at least a few different ships. One freighter, one fighter, and one corvette (which would probably be the skunk). With so few, each would have to be its own ship somehow. So something like in the fighter's case, it would be a one of a kind stolen from the Argon and completed by a famous pirate on his secret base or something. The freighter belonging to a legendary smuggler etc.

Point is, from what I've seen of X4 it seems like they want to make X Rebirth + X3. I can't see it.

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