Has anybody noticed a glaring omission. The Split

Nikola515 · Post by **Nikola515** » Tue, 19. Dec 17, 17:26

Not enough time ? When is X4 coming out than ?

I just hope they dont do each race DLC for 10$ (Terrans,Split,Boran) lol.

iforgotmysocks · Post by **iforgotmysocks** » Tue, 19. Dec 17, 17:31

I was hoping that time wouldn't be too much of a factor this time and they could release upon reaching a desirable stage of development. Hearing that even main factions aren't included duo to time related reasons makes me a bit sad. Rather push it for another year and do it right.

Please? <3

Skeeter · Post by **Skeeter** » Tue, 19. Dec 17, 17:33

Time is a factor but budget is higher on the list, I'm sure if they had more funds it would extend Dev time to do more. Fact of life unfortunately.

iforgotmysocks · Post by **iforgotmysocks** » Tue, 19. Dec 17, 17:37

They didn't earn bad with Rebith i imagine. Rebirth seemed to have alot more international attention + steam + a ton of preorders. By the time ppl started to get mad about the state of the game alot money must've been made already. :^)

csaba · Post by **csaba** » Tue, 19. Dec 17, 18:50

XR with all DLCs only has 3 fully developed (functioning) factions and all were Argon and 2 of them were identical in ship and station design.

- The split had 1 cheese wedge of a station, 1 weak destroyer and 1-2 fighters
- The Teladi had a few but not as detailed as the Argon's
- The Canterans had like 4 station variants but atleast unique ships
- Terracorp was a copy paste of Albion with a different layout
- Kha'ak and Xenon had their usual token stations and their ships
- All pirates flew the same ships.
- Albion and Omicron were the only 2 fully unique entities.

Honestly if we get 3 fully functioning races (Argon, Teladi, Paranid) with unique systems/wares then we would get more than XR with all it's DLCs combined.

I don't really mind. Since XR's production/ware system is already a lot more complicated than the previous titles. I can barely recognize the OL stations and ships from their name and what they do after quite a lot of playtime. So 3 for me would be plenty to play around with.

iforgotmysocks · Post by **iforgotmysocks** » Wed, 20. Dec 17, 02:48

csaba wrote:Honestly if we get 3 fully functioning races (Argon, Teladi, Paranid) with unique systems/wares then we would get more than XR with all it's DLCs combined.

I don't really mind. Since XR's production/ware system is already a lot more complicated than the previous titles. I can barely recognize the OL stations and ships from their name and what they do after quite a lot of playtime. So 3 for me would be plenty to play around with.

Fair point.

Nikola515 · Post by **Nikola515** » Thu, 21. Dec 17, 15:27

I think it would be better idea for them to have single big DLC (similar to AP or even TC) for 30$ than small DLC like what they did with XR. All though it cant be helped with Boran and Split now I'm just sad about ships. Stations pretty much build same wares so I don't personally care if they have Split designs.

Skeeter · Post by **Skeeter** » Thu, 21. Dec 17, 16:22

Not paying 30 for just 2 races, maybe 14.99 but that's 2 races and missions for em.

spankahontis · Post by **spankahontis** » Thu, 21. Dec 17, 17:22

Yeah, the Split need some serious love.
Apart from a Split Viper Destroyer, 2 fighter classes in Maelstrom and TWO NPC clothes, they are beyond bare bones, I hope X4 changes all that, gives them a ton of new faces, female Split, ships and station modules.
Plus differences in appearance and culture to show the many different Split Clans.

Riccardoman · Post by **Riccardoman** » Thu, 21. Dec 17, 17:50

Early access to avoid terrible launch state and for developing the base game with the suggestions of the community

Patches to fix bugs and issues with the game

Major patches to bring new features and improvements

MANY DLC s to expand the universe, more variety: more races more game starts, more ships more stations and new solar systems

Nikola515 · Post by **Nikola515** » Thu, 21. Dec 17, 17:53

Skeeter wrote:Not paying 30 for just 2 races, maybe 14.99 but that's 2 races and missions for em.

I was thinking more like X3R and TC. It is almost same game but with also new content and brings much more to the table. If they bring in Boron,Terrans,Split new plot & ships/stations than I wouldn't mind. But if they do same what they did with XR DLC I wouldn't even bother getting them. The only thing that concerns me in X4 so far is AI. We still haven't seen any combat (up close) and we haven't seen how player ships and enemy AI behave in combat.

Skeeter · Post by **Skeeter** » Thu, 21. Dec 17, 18:06

If they add all that then fair enough 30 might be ok.

Ai can be tricky, depends on the person doing it and engine ability and how ships are setup etc. I'm not sure but I think AI is one of the later things to be done in development as u gotta fill the game with assets first then audio and this and that then get stuff working basically then refine it then blah blah. Ai can be as basic or as complex as can be, we just have to see really. Maybe they will stream a let's play session of first 30 mins or a game start and it will show combat near time of release in a stream party of sorts.

Maybe a dedicated AI topic can be made and ask Dev questions, they maybe able to answer but then again maybe not, u never know.

spankahontis · Post by **spankahontis** » Fri, 22. Dec 17, 23:19

Nikola515 wrote:
Skeeter wrote:Not paying 30 for just 2 races, maybe 14.99 but that's 2 races and missions for em.
I was thinking more like X3R and TC. It is almost same game but with also new content and brings much more to the table. If they bring in Boron,Terrans,Split new plot & ships/stations than I wouldn't mind. But if they do same what they did with XR DLC I wouldn't even bother getting them. The only thing that concerns me in X4 so far is AI. We still haven't seen any combat (up close) and we haven't seen how player ships and enemy AI behave in combat.

The Ai worries me so far, watched the latest Q&A Video and I noticed some fighters? Bouncing off others in Rebirth fashion, plus the landing animations of ships were not present, their landing legs had no suspension on them; was like watching a child land a toy spaceship on a coffee table, I hope this is because it's in alpha, that they will add these animations in later?

csaba · Post by **csaba** » Fri, 22. Dec 17, 23:40

spankahontis wrote:
Nikola515 wrote:
Skeeter wrote:Not paying 30 for just 2 races, maybe 14.99 but that's 2 races and missions for em.
I was thinking more like X3R and TC. It is almost same game but with also new content and brings much more to the table. If they bring in Boron,Terrans,Split new plot & ships/stations than I wouldn't mind. But if they do same what they did with XR DLC I wouldn't even bother getting them. The only thing that concerns me in X4 so far is AI. We still haven't seen any combat (up close) and we haven't seen how player ships and enemy AI behave in combat.

The Ai worries me so far, watched the latest Q&A Video and I noticed some fighters? Bouncing off others in Rebirth fashion, plus the landing animations of ships were not present, their landing legs had no suspension on them; was like watching a child land a toy spaceship on a coffee table, I hope this is because it's in alpha, that they will add these animations in later?

The ship's flight AI is probably ported mostly from the latest XR build, which is quite good in my opinion, ramming stations happens but it came a long way since it's release.

I'm pretty sure they will add the landing animations. The reason why the ships sunk into the ground for a second was in fact an indicator of that. The ship already "bounces" just the landing gears don't have the joints installed and animated yet.

It's not a priority, I'd be happy with Space Engineers style static landing as well if the game runs otherwise properly and the time was needed for other more important areas.

daniel001 · Post by **daniel001** » Wed, 3. Jan 18, 18:16

linolafett wrote:Just not enough manpower to create them in time, sorry.
Personally i think getting those in at a later stage after we finished the base game is maybe (!) possible. (doesnt mean that this is going to happen, it is just my opinion)
I would love to add the missing races with all their ships and staions/economies into the game. boron love.

EDIT:

Split and Boron missing would be utter crap.
This is a REAL bummer.

Taking out the most "different" races = horrible design choice.

nemesis1982 · Post by **nemesis1982** » Wed, 3. Jan 18, 18:49

daniel001 wrote:Split and Boron missing would be utter crap.

To be honest the Split are there. They just do not have their own space nor their own ships.

daniel001 wrote:Taking out the most "different" races = horrible design choice.

I wouldn't call it taking them out. I think haven't been ported would be more appropriate. Also them differing much is probably the reason they won't be getting around to it for now.

Further more you forgot to mention the Terrans they do not seem to be in as well

Post by **Tomonor** » Wed, 3. Jan 18, 18:56

daniel001 wrote:

Split and Boron missing would be utter crap.
This is a REAL bummer.

Taking out the most "different" races = horrible design choice.

They have to start somewhere. This game has a lot more detail than X3AP and X-Rebirth combined.

But then again, they stated that there will be about 10 factions in X4. We can interpret that as there will be "mixed" races, for example pirate clans.

And let's not forget that they can add the races later via DLCs, if they ever get around them (similarly to the Teladi and Kha'ak in X-R, but with greater again - pilotable ships and all).

nemesis1982 · Post by **nemesis1982** » Wed, 3. Jan 18, 19:52

repatomonor wrote: But then again, they stated that there will be about 10 factions in X4. We can interpret that as there will be "mixed" races, for example pirate clans.

During which live stream did they say that? Do not remember that. Would be curious to know if every faction has their own ship designs and sectors

daniel001 · Post by **daniel001** » Thu, 4. Jan 18, 10:50

nemesis1982 wrote:
daniel001 wrote:Split and Boron missing would be utter crap.
To be honest the Split are there. They just do not have their own space nor their own ships.

daniel001 wrote:Taking out the most "different" races = horrible design choice.
I wouldn't call it taking them out. I think haven't been ported would be more appropriate. Also them differing much is probably the reason they won't be getting around to it for now.

Thats not "in there" for all that is relevant.
I really love Split ships, the unique mix of high speed, very strong weapons loadout + low shields make them an interesting and good choice for the seasoned pilot. And while i sorta understand the reasoning behind not putting in Borons for the reasons Bernd stated, i think that the Cockpit stuff with an actual PC is wasted design space needlessly overcomplicating other stuff.
Heck, it doesn't even look good.
NPCs looked like Spacepoop in X2, they still do now. Just cut them out again.

Regarding the posibility of Race DLCs:
Sure, could be done.
But that still leaves a pretty sour aftertaste and there is a high chance of them not being organically in the system if added by this.

Not intrigued.

They have to start somewhere. This game has a lot more detail than X3AP and X-Rebirth combined.

The latter is doubted until proven true.
AP had TON of details and stuff to do.

Regarding the former:
I'd rather have them spending a bit more development time on it instead.
I'll be frank:
I have every single X game save for XR:VR, several actually multiple times. I even threw money at the Rebirth DLC because while i was utterly pissed at the release state of XR, i was of the firm opinion that Egosoft is able to learn from their faults and should they not go down, would surely release a proper X4 someday.
It seems like i was right, but this shit with cutting out two of the actually interesting factions?
Its making me heavily consider waiting to buy X4 until its on sale.
And i would honestly prefer it otherwise, because i absolutely LOVE the X games.

Further more you forgot to mention the Terrans they do not seem to be in as well

Eh, screw those.

Vandragorax · Post by **Vandragorax** » Thu, 4. Jan 18, 12:51

Honestly I think some of you guys need to step back and accept the realisation that Egosoft is a small team and they have limited time and budget.

They have learnt lessons from Rebirth's release and general feedback about the game, taken this on board and are pretty much re-making the game again (after Rebirth already 're-imagined' the game once) in a new rendering engine.

Not only this but there are entirely new ship designs and they are spending a lot of time on making some great new features work well such as the modular station building, proper docking on capitals/stations, and the minimap features for empire control.

If all of these things can be achieved alongside 3 fleshed out races plus the Xenon (which we don't know for sure yet if they are going to include pilotable ships and/or a full station/sector economy like the other races) then that seems absolutely viable at point of release to me.

Don't forget they will be aiming for MVP (Minimum viable product) for release and with Egosoft's track record we will see many years of large content patches and reasonably priced DLCs coming along afterwards.

I hate seeing a lot of forum posts with people getting their pants in a twist about "missing" things, just let the base game get made first, don't expect the same level of detail with regards to things like races as there have been in 3 previous games + expansions (Teladi were an expansion in Rebirth, Kha'ak were an expansion in X2, and Terran were an expansion in X3).

Let them keep the main focus on the 'basic' factions and features, let Egosoft get those things right and then further stuff can be added on top afterwards.

egosoft.com

egosoft.com

Has anybody noticed a glaring omission. The Split