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Feel of threat or danger in the galaxy
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Baconfortress





Joined: 12 Jun 2012
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PostPosted: Sat, 23. Dec 17, 03:50    Post subject: Feel of threat or danger in the galaxy Reply with quote Print

As a longtime x fan I found one of my biggest issues with rebirth, which was also a strength of X3, is the feeling of menace throughout non-core space, or in rebirths case the lack thereof.

In X3 the second you leave a core system xenon and khaak raids start threatening you and your transports or stations. The war in albion prelude created big zones of conflict, and the xenon would even push into the core regions.

With mods full scale wars between races meant nowhere was safe unless you had the guns to protect something yourself. It made for a fun and dynamic universe, where protecting your ships and stations was part of doing business.

Rebirth was quite the opposite, id take missions to defend stations and literally fly away as the systems batteries of guns and armadas of destroyers obliterated the 4 m4 sized ships that came in. "dangerous" space consisted of a few split raiders in the maelstrom and the xenon hive. My stations would never need weapons, attacking literally any system was either a total victory for a single combat capital ship, or required you taking on half the PMC.

The question here for x4 foundations is how will this be handled. Will every occupied sector be bristling with war assets or only the most secure? are raids that threaten sectors and the stations in them a factor necessitating defenses for stations and the like? Will there be factions or regions small enough not to require absurd resources to fight (the yaki and pirates in x3 come to mind, both had sectors and stations but they were noticeably weaker and smaller than the others)

Rebirth was absurdly gorgeous to fly in, and home of light and the teladi outpost did make the universe seem a bit more alive and dangerous, but I seldom felt as big a force in it as previous titles.


TL/DR: Will building space stations and trade routes require defensive weapons and escorts to function in a dangerous galaxy, or will they operate in the relative safety of massive military security/world without attacking foes.

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csaba





Joined: 26 Aug 2005
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PostPosted: Sat, 23. Dec 17, 11:56    Post subject: Re: Feel of threat or danger in the galaxy Reply with quote Print

Baconfortress wrote:
As a longtime x fan I found one of my biggest issues with rebirth, which was also a strength of X3, is the feeling of menace throughout non-core space, or in rebirths case the lack thereof.

In X3 the second you leave a core system xenon and khaak raids start threatening you and your transports or stations. The war in albion prelude created big zones of conflict, and the xenon would even push into the core regions.

With mods full scale wars between races meant nowhere was safe unless you had the guns to protect something yourself. It made for a fun and dynamic universe, where protecting your ships and stations was part of doing business.

Rebirth was quite the opposite, id take missions to defend stations and literally fly away as the systems batteries of guns and armadas of destroyers obliterated the 4 m4 sized ships that came in. "dangerous" space consisted of a few split raiders in the maelstrom and the xenon hive. My stations would never need weapons, attacking literally any system was either a total victory for a single combat capital ship, or required you taking on half the PMC.

The question here for x4 foundations is how will this be handled. Will every occupied sector be bristling with war assets or only the most secure? are raids that threaten sectors and the stations in them a factor necessitating defenses for stations and the like? Will there be factions or regions small enough not to require absurd resources to fight (the yaki and pirates in x3 come to mind, both had sectors and stations but they were noticeably weaker and smaller than the others)

Rebirth was absurdly gorgeous to fly in, and home of light and the teladi outpost did make the universe seem a bit more alive and dangerous, but I seldom felt as big a force in it as previous titles.


TL/DR: Will building space stations and trade routes require defensive weapons and escorts to function in a dangerous galaxy, or will they operate in the relative safety of massive military security/world without attacking foes.


What the devs told us sofar is that factions in the game will go to war with each other and change territory while also building their own stations. How this will be implemented is still a mystery and probably remain one until the game is out.

So yes danger will be there especially if the campaign pushes you towards being the enemy of a certain faction like it happened with the PMC in XR. Of course if you are on good terms with every major faction you'll feel less heat since I expect Xenon and Pirates to be a lesser threat than invasion fleets from the majors.

On a different note if you install the CWR mod on XR you'll get pretty much all out war in the whole game if you have issues with danger there.

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nemesis1982





Joined: 29 Oct 2008
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PostPosted: Sat, 23. Dec 17, 12:39    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

I would like to see a number of secure sectors with less opportunities and then more dangerous ones where you have more opportunities.

I for one hated that you had traders dying all over the place in TC since there was no good way of protecting your assets (now if there would be a good way of protecting your assets that would be fine). However building a production chain and having your traders shot down without being able to do anything against it is just frustrating!

I would like to stress that I do not want to have search for hours for good mods to resolve those issues.


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iforgotmysocks





Joined: 08 Nov 2013



PostPosted: Sat, 23. Dec 17, 13:39    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

nemesis1982 wrote:
I would like to see a number of secure sectors with less opportunities and then more dangerous ones where you have more opportunities.

I for one hated that you had traders dying all over the place in TC since there was no good way of protecting your assets (now if there would be a good way of protecting your assets that would be fine). However building a production chain and having your traders shot down without being able to do anything against it is just frustrating!

I would like to stress that I do not want to have search for hours for good mods to resolve those issues.

Hm, fleeing mechanics in X-R work quite well and usually give the player some time to see whats going on with a ship before it dies. With a little improvement i don't see why X4 shouldn't be a harsh place in terms of conflict.

Also they already mentioned that there's gonna be "saver" space to be in the center of the galaxy, but building stations there will come at a high cost.

The farther u're gonna be building from the highway supported center, the more dangerous it might be.

Altho i've no clue yet how layout and this "center" is supposed to look like. One for each race? All together closeby? I have no clue. Very Happy


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csaba





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PostPosted: Sat, 23. Dec 17, 15:05    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

As iforgotmysocks said ships in fleets have better defenses now.

In XR ships belonging to the same group and are close to each other have their HP and Damage combined in out of sector scenarios. So if you put a destroyer next to your traders they are actually safer when your not in the same zone than when you are there and the ships are animated.

EDIT: Regarding this topic what I would like to see is the ability to set patrol routes for my military ships. "Patrol zone/system" in previous games rarely achieved it's goal ships tended to wander of to far away corners and were always late to an actual situation where they were needed.

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Baconfortress





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PostPosted: Sat, 23. Dec 17, 20:56    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

Quote:
I for one hated that you had traders dying all over the place in TC since there was no good way of protecting your assets (now if there would be a good way of protecting your assets that would be fine). However building a production chain and having your traders shot down without being able to do anything against it is just frustrating!


I mean with the exception of a xenon Q instamurdering them OOS (which is a must fix when playing) an escort of an m6 and maybe some m3s was more than enough. With an emergency jump drive and some defenses they could get out too. My traders in rebirth never got attacked to my recollection.

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nemesis1982





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PostPosted: Sun, 24. Dec 17, 00:16    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

Never really got into XR so far as to have fleets and many stations. I tried it once and it was a hell just getting the simple stuff working. From what I read it's better now I just never got back into it.


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csaba





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PostPosted: Sun, 24. Dec 17, 00:30    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

nemesis1982 wrote:
Never really got into XR so far as to have fleets and many stations. I tried it once and it was a hell just getting the simple stuff working. From what I read it's better now I just never got back into it.


It's still a mess compared to the map shown for X4 or even X3 wings. You still need to comm each ship and assign it's superior. Escort ships still don't react to aggression if you are in system unless the lead ship is attacked. What makes them strong is OOS when they combine their stats in battle.

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