Need to vent

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OldUserMoreAndLess
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Need to vent

Post by OldUserMoreAndLess » Sat, 2. Dec 17, 01:39

Hi the good people of the offtopic part of the forum. I have been user on this forum for long time actually, despite not contributing much but due to the username I use here also being in use on other forums that my co-workers know that belongs to me, I decided to create new account here in order to post this message.

From what I know of forums rules - this is not a breach unless I use it to manipulate a discussion or spam the forums. If I am in wrong - I am very sorry.

This is my story. I work in a company that goes through troubled times. I have been employed as basically grunt in the company fours years ago.
Before that I was without job for couple of years. When I finally got the job in this company, despite being met by a very unprofessional environment, I was grateful - I worked my ass off, working all days of week in order to prove my self.
I got rapid promotions, working then hard to improve the environment of my company for which employees working in my team were very grateful for. Then I got another promotion and once again I worked hard to improve my department. The hight turnover stopped. We managed to produce more while spending less money (less money lost due to fewer complaints which were endemic before I changed the process). Now, I am not saying I made all this happen by myself - I had wonderful people on my department who actually did all the hard work. I don't think I will ever be so lucky to work with so good bunch of people.
Time went and I got promoted again. This time I am among the top leadership. To be honest I am sheep among the wolves.

Few days ago, while I was in a meeting with an company we want to cooperate with, an employee that works in my department overheard contents of the meeting between other managers. Due to the content of conversation being such at is, she took up conversation on her phone. Later that day she called me and retold what she overheard. A day after I also heard the parts that she had recorded on her phone.

The meeting was between general manager and three other heads of the departments. Subject : trash talking me. Every single mistake I had done last 3 months was blown up out of the proportions. Then (this part was taped actually) I heard three people literally presenting me as fraud to the GM, telling that the meeting they had with me were useless and that the employees were muttering about me and were dissatisfied except few individuals. There was a mix of fantasy with drips of truth here and there. But the message was - I am weird (I am using a polite word here), unreliable, not being a productive member of the company and basically I should not be allowed unsupervised among customers (which is funny - they call me when they cannot receive response from the company in timely manner)
I am still in shock after all of this - I couldn't listen to the recording of the meeting in one go because I got so emotional from time to time. But basically my career is dead before it really started. Frankly at this point I don't think about the injustice of it all but the senseless effort - none of the four other people will benefit of this in the long run. Heck, not even in the short run.

With GM agreeing with three people telling him the same thing (why shouldn't he?) I will probably receive a letter of termination in near future. Basically all my hard work, countless hours of my free time spent for the company - down the f****** drain.

:(

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Re: Need to vent

Post by Skism » Sat, 2. Dec 17, 02:52

OldUserMoreAndLess wrote:Hi the good people of the offtopic part of the forum. I have been user on this forum for long time actually, despite not contributing much but due to the username I use here also being in use on other forums that my co-workers know that belongs to me, I decided to create new account here in order to post this message.

From what I know of forums rules - this is not a breach unless I use it to manipulate a discussion or spam the forums. If I am in wrong - I am very sorry.

This is my story. I work in a company that goes through troubled times. I have been employed as basically grunt in the company fours years ago.
Before that I was without job for couple of years. When I finally got the job in this company, despite being met by a very unprofessional environment, I was grateful - I worked my ass off, working all days of week in order to prove my self.
I got rapid promotions, working then hard to improve the environment of my company for which employees working in my team were very grateful for. Then I got another promotion and once again I worked hard to improve my department. The hight turnover stopped. We managed to produce more while spending less money (less money lost due to fewer complaints which were endemic before I changed the process). Now, I am not saying I made all this happen by myself - I had wonderful people on my department who actually did all the hard work. I don't think I will ever be so lucky to work with so good bunch of people.
Time went and I got promoted again. This time I am among the top leadership. To be honest I am sheep among the wolves.

Few days ago, while I was in a meeting with an company we want to cooperate with, an employee that works in my department overheard contents of the meeting between other managers. Due to the content of conversation being such at is, she took up conversation on her phone. Later that day she called me and retold what she overheard. A day after I also heard the parts that she had recorded on her phone.

The meeting was between general manager and three other heads of the departments. Subject : trash talking me. Every single mistake I had done last 3 months was blown up out of the proportions. Then (this part was taped actually) I heard three people literally presenting me as fraud to the GM, telling that the meeting they had with me were useless and that the employees were muttering about me and were dissatisfied except few individuals. There was a mix of fantasy with drips of truth here and there. But the message was - I am weird (I am using a polite word here), unreliable, not being a productive member of the company and basically I should not be allowed unsupervised among customers (which is funny - they call me when they cannot receive response from the company in timely manner)
I am still in shock after all of this - I couldn't listen to the recording of the meeting in one go because I got so emotional from time to time. But basically my career is dead before it really started. Frankly at this point I don't think about the injustice of it all but the senseless effort - none of the four other people will benefit of this in the long run. Heck, not even in the short run.

With GM agreeing with three people telling him the same thing (why shouldn't he?) I will probably receive a letter of termination in near future. Basically all my hard work, countless hours of my free time spent for the company - down the f****** drain.

:(
WOW this is unfortunate im sorry :(

basically you are dealing with people backstabbing you

This might not be entirely applicable to you but you are dealing with a similar attack mentality:

http://www.milobookclub.com/mart/SJW_At ... _Guide.pdf

a few key points:

1 1. Rely on the Three Rs: RECOGNIZE it is happening. REMAIN calm. REALIZE no one cares.

1a start looking for a new Job asap

2. Don't try to reason with them.

3. Do not apologize. Apology = guilt

5.5. Document their every word and action < this last one is REALLY important to your situation....demonstrate their lies if you are asked or even have an opportunity to show them.

Lastly 6. Do not resign!

Remember that it is very important to not jump before you are pushed UNLESS you have a better job lined up.
"He who dares not offend cannot be honest."

-Thomas Paine-

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Stars_InTheirEyes
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Post by Stars_InTheirEyes » Sat, 2. Dec 17, 03:40

Would you mind telling us what country you live in?
This is in the event of a worst case scenario: I don't know much, but in the UK there are things called tribunals which you can go to if you get unfairly dismissed. Over here, employers shouldn't just say "you're fired because we don't like you". If they do, you can take it to a tribunal. More information about employment tribunals here: https://www.gov.uk/employment-tribunals

My advice would be to take the matter into your own hands. Go to your General Manager and directly ask them if they think there are any problems with your work and how you might improve it. I'm not making assumptions, but try to keep an open mind and take on board what they say. Unless its pure tripe, of course.

Good luck. Sounds like a tough situation but it sounds like you do have some allies in there.
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burger1
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Post by burger1 » Sat, 2. Dec 17, 04:23

Don't get worked up about it and turn it into a self fulfilling prophecy. I have seen many people do this. They are in your situation and they catastrophize the situation/events. Then they start to do weird things like make irrational statements, assault people, freak out on managers/other employees, etc... Just because people trash talk you doesn't necessarily mean you are in trouble. Try not to make more mistakes. Don't mention your friend recording them since it can backfire on her and is in some cases illegal.

https://psychcentral.com/lib/what-is-catastrophizing/

You might be on the autism spectrum (I include depression in this category since it's very similar)?
-I should not be allowed unsupervised among customers (which is funny - they call me when they cannot receive response from the company in timely manner)
-I am weird
-unreliable

You might want to look into emotional disregulation also. If you find that you get very angry and your thoughts run away with you maybe look into taking magnesium citrate and/or L-theanine. They might calm you down and let you be more normal. Magnesium citrate is cheap and it should help smooth out the bumps. Only take the amount you need which might be much less than the recommend amount. Magnesium oxide is mostly nonreactive so don't use it. L-theanine doesn't work for everyone and there's a large difference in quality between suppliers. It only lasts about 3 hours and takes about 15 minutes to kick it. It is also easily overpowered by prescription stimulants and some non prescription stimulants. If it works it's great. You might not be able to get physically angry at all if it works well.


-How was the person in your current position before you removed? How long were they there? How long do people seem to last at your current job? Four years is a short amount of time.
Last edited by burger1 on Sat, 2. Dec 17, 16:07, edited 1 time in total.

Alan Phipps
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Post by Alan Phipps » Sat, 2. Dec 17, 15:52

@ OP: If you are a head of department and the GM is your line manager then just ask for a one-to-one performance and progression review with him; you have that right at any time with your line manager.

At the review, say that you have heard third-hand rumours of some unsettling reports about your performance in-post and that you wish to respond to any 'management issues' that the GM feels may need your explanation or acknowledgement.

At the very least you can also tell the GM what you have tried to do and have achieved in-post (if he is your line manager then he should already know!). Also you could invite the GM to discuss any issues formally or informally with any of your actual subordinates rather than hearing uninformed opinion from other non-involved departments.

Good luck.
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Post by mrbadger » Sat, 2. Dec 17, 16:12

Something rather similar happened to me once when I was a nurse, except I was working for the NHS, and they have rather strict rules to stop people getting away with it, if your strong enough to cope, which at the time I only just was.

(I was coping with some pretty nasty personal events at the time, which is usually when bullies attack).

It's not nice, I'm sorry it's happening, but it just shows that they are asshats, not you. You just have to keep in mind that you are the victim, not the person responsible.
If an injury has to be done to a man it should be so severe that his vengeance need not be feared. ... Niccolò Machiavelli

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Re: Need to vent

Post by Morkonan » Sat, 2. Dec 17, 22:15

OldUserMoreAndLess wrote:...This time I am among the top leadership. To be honest I am sheep among the wolves.
Yes, yes you are. Welcome to the higher echelons of dreaded corporate culture.

As you are rising through the ranks, meritoriously to be sure, the available space above you for further advancement shrinks dramatically. Further advancement then becomes a mix of performance, influence, real power and corporate politics. Those who have kept their attention solely focused on good goal-oriented performance, achieving necessary goals and diligently trying to contribute to making advancements for the good of the company, will often find themselves confronted by a dynamic foreign to them and will find themselves put in the unfamiliar position of being surrounded by wolves stalking in the unfamiliar darkness of the boardroom...

You're likely surrounded by people either attempting to retain their position by any means necessary or fighting others to defend their position by any means necessary. The "stakes" are much higher and the fall much greater. It's likely these people have much more invested in their positions than the average corporate line soldier... And, given your description, it's likely that instead of choosing a route of meritorious contributions for the good of the company, they achieved their position by the equally effective methods of backstabbing and political manipulation.

It appears you are somewhat lost, here, and confused. That's only understandable, given your description of previous experiences in the company and how you attribute your rise in station. Well, if this is true, then I think you have one course of action:

1) Get your resume up to date. You may not need it, but given the influence of your opponents, it may be inevitable that you will.

2) Given what appears to be your length of service and experience, start looking for potential employment recruiters if you haven't already established such contacts. It won't hurt, no matter what happens, to multiply your effectiveness at finding better employment.

3) It may be you have no allies in senior leadership. If that is the case, then your only option is to make an appeal and state your case to your superiors. Once you have the above two steps either completed or well on their way, request a one-on-one with your superior (General Manager?). During this meeting, I would:

a) Admit that you have been informed by a third-party that there is significant opposition against you and that others are attempting to influence the General Manager using what you believe are unfair tactics. (Under no circumstances, whatsoever, should you reveal that any recordings of such conversations exist and you should not reveal the source of your information. If your General Manager denies any of this ever took place, then you're most likely about to be fired, anyway, so you may as well just end the meeting, thank them for their time, and start looking for a new job.)

b) Tell your superior that you are dedicated to the company and list your achievements as well as admitting your faults and failures. Most important is to demonstrate how you have learned from any failures and mistakes and to demonstrate the steps you have taken to minimize the chance those could occur again.

c) Restate your dedication to the success of the company and make sure that, despite this political struggle and what appears to be a coordinated campaign against you, it is clear to your superior that you are willing to work past this issue and to continue to focus on the work and responsibilities you have for the benefit of the company.

d) Ask your manager what their concerns are and how they would like to see you handle this issue or any problems they have with your in your current position. Address those issues and acknowledge that they are "real", if only because your manager has those concerns. Where they are false, point that out as diplomatically as possible and tell them how you will alleviate them. Where they are true or unavoidable, tell them how you would go about solving them and be sure, always, to ask the manager what they feel are the best ways to solve such problems.

4) Lastly, don't expect decisions based on "logic" which only considers meritorious performance of your duties. You're in a different position, now. Even if your manager is truly concerned with such issues, it appears that they have fostered an environment that allows other factors to influence the upper echelons of management.

5) At the end of the day, your General Manager is going to be concerned about how effective their managers are at working together. It doesn't matter if you "crap gold" for the company, every day. Unless your performance and value can overshadow the worth of the three other managers that are working against you, you have an untenable position and your General Manager may decide to relieve you of your duties if only to satisfy the complaints of your opponents and "bring peace" to his cadre of sub-commanders... :(

Some people take easily to rising through the ranks of such a culture and some do not. The key strategy to being successful is to plan your battles in advance and to set the stage for your rise in power by manipulating the decisions and opinions of those above you as well as those who hold lateral positions to yours and the position that you seek. If the culture is such that you can not survive in a higher position if you have not done these things... then you won't. It's that simple, unfortunately. :(

The leaders at the top are responsible for the corporate culture experienced by those on the lower rungs of the ladder. At the end of the day, this sort of cutthroat struggle in upper management is responsible for your experience and it may be that you will never be happy in this company, given your new position. This is why some people reach certain levels in their company where it is inevitable that they will end up leaving the company... It's also why some employees prefer not to seek advancement in a company, choosing to remain in the background in "technical" departments rather than in "management" roles.

Good luck and very best wishes for you. It appears you likely have the experience to be a valued addition to a company that is worth your efforts and that will make you much happier than your current one.

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Re: Need to vent

Post by fiksal » Sun, 3. Dec 17, 19:02

OldUserMoreAndLess wrote:But basically my career is dead before it really started.
yeah, it's crap. Without knowing details of what you do, I'd not say that though. Capitalize on what you know and your experience. You are a professional of what you do now.

Look for something better else where. And in better company. Dont work in a toxic environment.

I know it can sound weird, and easier said than done, but still, I think that's what I'd do in that situation.

Though not required, you could have an honest chat with the head guy. Though I think this shouldnt be in any way be steered towards you being blamed for anything, as the (bad) manager might do. Tell him/her straight that you are fully aware of that conversation, and see where they want to go from there. Maybe someone needs to go.

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Update 01

Post by OldUserMoreAndLess » Fri, 15. Dec 17, 21:43

Update:

Basically I followed Morkonan advice with few modifications. It is too much convoluted story to put it all here but basically everybody involved, except one the department heads, are pretending that nothing is amiss and that the meeting was about the above mentioned department head venting his frustration. Basically no loyalty among thiefs.

GM is pretending that this is minor issue and that as long as I deliver on my appointed tasks, I got nothing to worry.

My current state of mind? I am contacting everyone I knew, putting it out there that I am looking for another job. CV is being updated. Not the right time of the year (in the part of europe I live) to look for another job, but you live the life you have not the one you wish for.

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Re: Update 01

Post by Morkonan » Sat, 16. Dec 17, 01:37

OldUserMoreAndLess wrote:...My current state of mind? I am contacting everyone I knew, putting it out there that I am looking for another job. CV is being updated. Not the right time of the year (in the part of europe I live) to look for another job, but you live the life you have not the one you wish for.
Get your resume in order while doing great work at your current job.

Contact people you know in the industry, but do so "discretely."

If there are recruiters in the area (Commercial job placement companies that work on a contractual basis with companies to find qualified employees) it may be beneficial for you to look into a suitable one. You will know who that is from what you've experienced in the industry and what your peers have to say about their experience with such companies. (Not sure of what's the normal course of business, there.)

In today's world, word-of-mouth still goes a long way, but not as far as it used to. Make sure you've got your stats updated on whatever social media is appropriate. (Lots of US tech types and others use "Linkedin" and the like to post their qualifications and experience. Commercial job placement companies regularly search these databases, so you could end up having a lot of offers in fairly short time if you create an entry or update an existing one.)

Good luck. No matter what the original reason for all this was, it's obvious you're not happy where you are and you don't feel secure there. That means you need to start looking somewhere else. Do so as you can without alerting your employer. Keep doing good work, stay dedicated to your job, but start thinking about yourself for a change.

OldUserMoreAndLess
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Update

Post by OldUserMoreAndLess » Sun, 18. Mar 18, 19:15

Small update here:

I landed interview with a company within two weeks after putting it out that I was looking for a new position. This is an older company with traditions where I had no chance to land job few years back. I was recommended to the CEO by another CEO that I contacted about a job.
After few tests I scored well enough for them to give me an offer which I signed right away.

Rather significant upgrade in salary if not position right now - also CEO telling me after three weeks that I need to have better work-life balance - major cultural shock - I feel like I am working at half speed and the guy says slow down!

My old company did not bother with setting up farewell event (which is rather standard practice in that company) so the employees invited me to the restaurant after work time to "compensate" for the lack of any official organization. It really felt great to see that employees appreciated me if not the management.

But I think this was a major positive event after all - I learned lot of office politics and where I have stepped wrong. Learning this let's say 10 years in future would have cost me more than it did today - in my age this is merely a small bump in road.

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Post by Alan Phipps » Sun, 18. Mar 18, 20:00

Good to hear it has ended well for you. :)

I'm guessing this particular username account can probably fade away as unused now?
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Post by OldUserMoreAndLess » Mon, 19. Mar 18, 07:59

Alan Phipps wrote:Good to hear it has ended well for you. :)
Thanks :)
Alan Phipps wrote: I'm guessing this particular username account can probably fade away as unused now?
Yes

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Morkonan
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Post by Morkonan » Mon, 19. Mar 18, 22:48

I'm very happy for you, OldUserMoreAndLess! Outstanding change of events and one that I hope continues to bring you a great deal of joy!

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Post by fiksal » Thu, 22. Mar 18, 20:05

Good stuff

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