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Skism
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Post by Skism » Thu, 7. Dec 17, 20:28

Muellers credibility gong down
The special prosecutor’s probe, which has already cost taxpayers some $5 million, hit a massive speed bump last week — the kind that snaps the axles and blows out the transmission. Reports emerged in both The Washington Post and The New York Times that a lead FBI investigator sent anti-Trump texts to a mistress. Weirdly, the investigator, Peter Strzok, wasn’t fired, just quietly demoted to the Bureau’s human resources department.
“Electronic records show Peter Strzok, who led the investigation of Hillary Clinton’s private email server as the No. 2 official in the counterintelligence division, changed Comey’s earlier draft language describing Clinton’s actions as ‘grossly negligent’ to ‘extremely careless,’ the sources said,” CNN reported. (Good job, Clinton News Network!)
Mr. Strzok was a “key figure in the chain of events when the bureau, in 2016, received the infamous anti-Trump ‘dossier’ and launched a counterintelligence investigation into Russian meddling in the election that ultimately came to encompass FISA surveillance of a Trump campaign associate,” Fox News reported.
The dossier was a compilation of rumors and lies about Mr. Trump put together by an opposition research team contracted by Democrats called Fusion GPS. Fusion’s records, obtained by House investigators, show the dossier was funded by the Clinton campaign and the Democratic National Committee.
https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/20 ... er-strzok/

Well it seems this investigation might have hit a stumbling block!
Last edited by Skism on Thu, 7. Dec 17, 20:38, edited 1 time in total.
"He who dares not offend cannot be honest."

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felter
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Post by felter » Thu, 7. Dec 17, 20:31

Santi wrote:The Jerusalem move makes a lot of sense. Looking at the facts, we have a "peace process" that has been going on since 1970, since 2003 it has been working on a two state solution. Then the Palestinians changed tack and as a new "negotiation tactic" started a civil war in 2007 among themselves.

On top of that a two state solution can only be agreed with Fatah, as Hamas is considered a terrorist organization and never will be allowed to gain power of an independent Palestinian state by Israel, United States and the European Union among others.

Just think that if Fatah was chosen (that will be) to rule an independent Palestine, Hamas will launch an all out attack, let's remember that Hamas got the biggest vote in the last elections, it will be carnage and South Sudan all over again.

So just carry on, declare Jerusalem the capital of Israel, de facto it already is, a sit down to the table and take what you get or we take everything is probably the best approach to palestinian talks right now.

As for destabilizing the Middle East, people have to be kidding.
Honestly that makes no sense at all, on what you are saying why didn't Trump just say, Jerusalem was the Palestinian capital as that is what they say it is, and Israel would have to sit down at the table and take what they get. Do you think the Israeli's would agree to this, I doubt it, but you are saying that the Palestinians should.

It is the most stupidest and dangerous idea out of all of the ideas, and the violence of today shows just why it is. All of the American consulates have had to bring in extra security with more marines having to help in protecting them due to this, if it is such a good idea then why have they had to do this.

It will not work and people will die from this simplest of actions, where as before they were not going to die, is that how you create peace, kill people. I know what, why not just kill all of the Palestinians and hey problem solved, that makes about as much sense.
I'm not saying he is a Russian asset, I'm saying he sat on his asset when he was supposed to be confronting Putin.
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Morkonan
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Post by Morkonan » Thu, 7. Dec 17, 20:55

Santi wrote:...So just carry on, declare Jerusalem the capital of Israel, de facto it already is, a sit down to the table and take what you get or we take everything is probably the best approach to palestinian talks right now.
Well, the problem with that is that the Palestinian leadership has said that if Jerusalem is recognized as the capital, then they don't want a "two state" solution. Instead, they want a single-state solution in Israel, but with "equal rights" for all citizens including Palestinians.

And, if that happens, then Israel will no longer be a "Jewish State." Palestinians would want equal rights, equal representationin government, cultural and religious recognition, etc... So long "Jewish State", hello "Cosmopolitcan Democratic Government." That would seriously tick off a lot of Israelis and that's probably why the Palestinian leadership is calling for this right now. :)
As for destabilizing the Middle East, people have to be kidding.
Well, riots have already broken out in Jerusalem. and radical elements across the Middle East are predictably calling for action. It remains to be seen what the full effect will be.

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BugMeister
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Post by BugMeister » Thu, 7. Dec 17, 22:40

Chris Hedges (Dec 06, 2017) - Stop Fascism - Chris Hedges in Portland, Oregon A KBOO Benefit
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gRta28B2LTI

- interesting commentary on the dangers of a crumbling empire
- the whole universe is running in BETA mode - we're working on it.. beep..!! :D :thumb_up:

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Santi
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Post by Santi » Thu, 7. Dec 17, 23:11

felter wrote:Honestly that makes no sense at all, on what you are saying why didn't Trump just say, Jerusalem was the Palestinian capital as that is what they say it is, and Israel would have to sit down at the table and take what they get.
No, because the British made sure that the Jews will get the bigger portion of the cake regarding Palestine. Fair enough, the UN did have a lot of responsibilities regarding the mess Palestine finds themselves right now. But the world at the time, gave the whole of those territories to Israel and that was fine.
Felter wrote:It will not work and people will die from this simplest of actions, where as before they were not going to die, is that how you create peace, kill people. I know what, why not just kill all of the Palestinians and hey problem solved, that makes about as much sense.
So how you explain Palestinians from Hamas killing Fatah palestinians?
Morkonan wrote:Well, the problem with that is that the Palestinian leadership
Is that the Fatah "dealership" or the Hamas "dealership"?

The Middle East is a mess, Libya, Iraq, Syria, Yemen, Qatar, Iran the whole lot is on the brink, recognizing Jerusalem as the capital of Israel is just sidenote on the madness that is engulfing the middle eastl
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RegisterMe
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Post by RegisterMe » Thu, 7. Dec 17, 23:25

Here's a link to the Washington Post story on Peter Strzok. I think it's a little more balanced in its reporting.

Oh, and here's the wiki entry concerning the Washington Times. Sounds a bit like a paper version of Fox.....
Gavrushka wrote:The problem with 'freedom of speech' is it makes wackos think they have something of value to say.

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Skism
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Post by Skism » Thu, 7. Dec 17, 23:35

RegisterMe wrote:Here's a link to the Washington Post story on Peter Strzok. I think it's a little more balanced in its reporting.

Oh, and here's the wiki entry concerning the Washington Times. Sounds a bit like a paper version of Fox.....

Unfortunately your link is behind a paywall.

I also have to say Im getting concerned by the new liberal tendency to dismiss based solely on source rather than charactor or truth or what as been said also from your Wiki Link:

The Washington Post became very arrogant and they just decided that they would determine what was news and what wasn't news and they wouldn't cover a lot of things that went on. And the Washington Times has forced the Post to cover a lot of things that they wouldn't cover if the Times wasn't in existence.[71]
"He who dares not offend cannot be honest."

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RegisterMe
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Post by RegisterMe » Thu, 7. Dec 17, 23:44

Strange, I'm not a WP reader and don't have a subscription so don't know why you got hit with a paywall and I didn't. Anywhere, here's the BBC version which covers much the same ground - link.

I'm not dismissing based on source, I am interested in the nature of the source to provide some context to the reporting. imho the Washington Times story was much more partisan, and clearly biased, than either the Post or the BBC coverage.

Also that's rather selective quoting from the wiki article :P .

EDIT: Fixed the link.
Last edited by RegisterMe on Fri, 8. Dec 17, 13:37, edited 1 time in total.
Gavrushka wrote:The problem with 'freedom of speech' is it makes wackos think they have something of value to say.

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Skism
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Post by Skism » Thu, 7. Dec 17, 23:57

RegisterMe wrote:Strange, I'm not a WP reader and don't have a subscription so don't know why you got hit with a paywall and I didn't. Anywhere, here's the BBC version which covers much the same ground - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-42270553.

I'm not dismissing based on source, I am interested in the nature of the source to provide some context to the reporting. imho the Washington Times story was much more partisan, and clearly biased, than either the Post or the BBC coverage.

Also that's rather selective quoting from the wiki article :P .
I get hit with something called 'basic digital'

And yes I thought that was a good quote to pick ;)

Hmm I'm also getting a 404 on your BBC link...
"He who dares not offend cannot be honest."

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The Q
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Post by The Q » Fri, 8. Dec 17, 00:01

Skism wrote:I also have to say Im getting concerned by the new liberal tendency to dismiss based solely on source rather than charactor or truth or what as been said also from your Wiki Link:

The Washington Post became very arrogant and they just decided that they would determine what was news and what wasn't news and they wouldn't cover a lot of things that went on. And the Washington Times has forced the Post to cover a lot of things that they wouldn't cover if the Times wasn't in existence.[71]
Now how is this quote which is clearly marked as an opinion from a single conservative commentator different to the Washington Times article you posted above also clearly marked as "ANALYSIS/OPINION"?
Skism wrote:Hmm I'm also getting a 404 on your BBC link...
Remove the dot from the link and it should work.
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RegisterMe
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Post by RegisterMe » Fri, 8. Dec 17, 00:38

Ahh sorry that's me being rubbish. I'll clean the link up when I'm at my pc / not on a phone.
Gavrushka wrote:The problem with 'freedom of speech' is it makes wackos think they have something of value to say.

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fiksal
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Post by fiksal » Fri, 8. Dec 17, 01:29

Looks like Mueller is just being super careful. Quite interesting.

So much tension, I wonder what he has. I mean, come on...

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Morkonan
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Post by Morkonan » Fri, 8. Dec 17, 02:11

Santi wrote:...Is that the Fatah "dealership" or the Hamas "dealership"?

The Middle East is a mess, Libya, Iraq, Syria, Yemen, Qatar, Iran the whole lot is on the brink, recognizing Jerusalem as the capital of Israel is just sidenote on the madness that is engulfing the middle eastl
The spokesman I caught just part of the interview with mentioned his representation of the PLO. Hamas was also mentioned. (An interview on CNN this afternoon.)

Yes, the ME is a mess. But, there is one all-important distinction - The "messes" are largely contained within individual countries. Now, personally, I am still concerned for all the human beings caught up in various messes. However, what the foreign policy people are most concerned with is international destabilization.

As long as they feel there is someone in a country they can talk to and make meaningful agreements with, no major power is going to do anything at all to try to solve these "internal" problems. It's only when they threaten the... uh.. er... "balance" of power in the region that major political players get upset.

It's a crappy deal, but that's politics... Though, if someone takes steps to promote destabilization and are caught undeniably "in flagrante delicto", all bets are off as to how powers like the US or others might react.

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Masterbagger
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Post by Masterbagger » Fri, 8. Dec 17, 04:27

felter wrote:
It will not work and people will die from this simplest of actions, where as before they were not going to die, is that how you create peace, kill people. I know what, why not just kill all of the Palestinians and hey problem solved, that makes about as much sense.
Israel would have been wiped off the map if they had not killed a shitload of people when their neighbors launched a war of extermination. It's an ugly truth that sometimes the only way to buy peace is to kill the guys who won't recognize your right to exist under your own culture. You can't stop monsters like that with appeasement. No nation should base their policy on how terrorists are likely to react.
Who made that man a gunner?

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felter
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Post by felter » Fri, 8. Dec 17, 05:39

Masterbagger wrote:
felter wrote:
It will not work and people will die from this simplest of actions, where as before they were not going to die, is that how you create peace, kill people. I know what, why not just kill all of the Palestinians and hey problem solved, that makes about as much sense.
Israel would have been wiped off the map if they had not killed a shitload of people when their neighbors launched a war of extermination. It's an ugly truth that sometimes the only way to buy peace is to kill the guys who won't recognize your right to exist under your own culture. You can't stop monsters like that with appeasement. No nation should base their policy on how terrorists are likely to react.
In my book and many others, Israel are terrorists. Saying that America is not at war with Palestine, so your argument is mute and stupid. War is a totally different thing, you could actually say that with what Trump has said he has declared war on Palestine, some are even saying this. Is that what you are saying, that America has declared war on Palestine, if so then I take it back your statement has validity and is not stupid.
I'm not saying he is a Russian asset, I'm saying he sat on his asset when he was supposed to be confronting Putin.
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