NEWS: X Rebirth Virtual Reality Edition - Early Access launch, XCon 2017 and X4

General discussions about X Rebirth.

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CBJ
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Post by CBJ » Wed, 2. Aug 17, 16:59

lplates wrote:Is it just starting development or are you announcing because you are getting close to alpha/beta stage?
Neither. Development is well underway, and some of the features are well enough established for us to be ready to start talking about them, but we're not at any testing stage yet

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Post by ezra-r » Wed, 2. Aug 17, 19:21

don't be shy. Where are the screenshots? (X4) :D

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Post by DavidGW » Thu, 3. Aug 17, 05:44

CBJ wrote:...and some of the features are well enough established for us to be ready to start talking about them...
You're just going to leave this here to taunt us, aren't you? :P

Don't leave us hanging! Pleeeeaseeee?????

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Post by kurush » Thu, 3. Aug 17, 06:35

UniTrader wrote:nothing to spoil really...
Vulkan API in Wikipedia
At least that means Egosoft is likely to keep the linux version, something that made me buy Rebirth even after all bad press :)

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Post by tanner1ie » Thu, 3. Aug 17, 23:36

Please, please, please make my dreams come true and be just about to announce X4 for the PS4 and if possible both just to help promote the release as well as to let us play them on our system of choice, throw a cherry on top by releasing, at least Reunion, Terran Conflict and Albion Prelude, if not the entire X series on Playstation.

I wouldn't be too bothered if ye didn't include Rebirth in a PS4 version of the Superbox, though honestly i've never really given the game a chance, not having time to play it with Reunion to AP existing :) .
(Partly because i lost all my X save files in an early 2012 harddrive failure and forced system recovery and had to restart playing TC and AP, but mostly because those three games are so big :) .)

But if Rebirth was available on PS4, i'd be much more likely to play it.

On bringing the X series to PS4, i wouldn't need or even want the core games to change in the slightly, aside from giving them trophy support, an optimised Dualshock 4 control scheme and the new ability to run on the system... :) .

While i have been playing the X series on my PC for nearly thirteen years, it's always been with a lot more effort and discomfort than i'd like and pretty much every moment i was wishing i was playing it on a Playstation.

Firstly my PC is in my kitchen and i've no real room to fit it in my bedroom, where my Playstations are.
That means i'm sitting in a pretty uncomfortable office chair the whole time, but since i very often play my games in the early hours, whenever i have long/late sessions in X, it means i'm left sneaking up the stairs at 6am or later in an effort not to wake the whole house.

Overall i'd just be more comfortable playing in my room on my PS4 while i'd also disturb my family less (if at all) when playing X late at night, when in there.

On controlling the X games, i've played all the games i've played in the series, Reunion, then jumping back to X2, Terran Conflict and Albion Prelude 95%, of the time with my controller (a Logitech Dualshock 2 knockoff).
The only times i ever have to use my keyboard is for secondary functions like activating Seta, my docking computer or opening my cargo bay etc and the recent pretty stellar PS4 port of Elite Dangerous (which i've been playing near constantly since it came out on PS4 at the June) has shown that all that games' original PC functions can be mapped to the Dualshock 4 by using button modifiers.
(The game doesn't even make full use of the DS4, pretty much wasting L3 on switching to alternative flight controls, which could be done with a menu and doesn't make use of the pad's touchpad at all - that i've noticed on the latter, on at least.)

About the only time i use the mouse in the current PC versions of the X series is to easily target specific things (though i do have a button set to cycle targets).
If you wanted to keep the current series mouse targetting, that could easily be done with the DS4, possibly with the touchpad, but probably more easily it could simply be a secondary function of the right stick, say after clicking R3.

Of course when i got into the X series in 2005, the Playstation on the market was the PS2 and while it might not have been powerful enough (though it might still have been as it was still an impressive system and a big step up from the PS1, though of course while the PS2 did have online games, PSN didn't exist so adding patches to games, like the X series, would have been difficult.), but surely the PS3 was (and even this late in its' lifescycle still is) powerful enough to run Reunion to AP and i've no doubts in the world the PS4 could run them and more than likely even Rebirth.
(I was still playing TC and AP on a nearly 12 year old Pentium 4 PC with only 1 gig of ram, 'til i replaced it late last year.

I currently own and have tested Rebirth on my new PC which was pretty cheap and though it indeed has 8 gigs of ram, it only has an integrated Intel HD 530 graphics card and the game runs perfectly (at approximately medium settings).

Of course Rebirth only requires 4 gigs of ram and recommends 8 gigs, while the PS4 comes with 8 gigs and fundamentally PC based architecture and parts.)

The, as far as i can see, flawless PC port of Elite Dangerous, near perfect port of Tropico 5 (which only lacks the PC version's option to increase your island's population limit) and flawed but functional port of Kerbal Space Programme, should be proof that at least, Reunion to AP and surely even Rebirth will play and run perfectly on PS4 :) .
(And i believe the main thing wrong with the PS4 port KSP is a secondary one of it often deleting/corrupting save games unexpectedly, while any other problems were caused by a third party developer rushing the game to the system, but the core game itself still apparently runs pretty perfectly - we're still waiting for the game in Europe after SCEE, Playstation Europe rejected the initial build on quality grounds. But the port came out in SCEA, Playstation U.S. territories, while we're patiently awaiting the new build of the game on European PS4s, *any day now TM*...) .

The system even has the Playstation VR if ye wanted to port Rebirth VR to the system :) .

So again in closing, please make (or be already making) the X series on Playstation a reality! :) .
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Post by LTerSlash » Fri, 4. Aug 17, 08:02

Im going to be honest here. I rather they dont waste any time intro Vulkan, to me it feels it takes just a huge amount of time just to get the same perf as DX.
i dont bite the "Doom-Vulkan" thing that just poor OpenGL perf on AMD cards.


That said, i have Ryzen 1700 + RX 580, so ill be probably the first one to see gains, but i rather they just focus on the gameplay.


Also i rather no PS4 support either, not because the PS4 cant run it, because i dont want the game to be dumb down to console levels more than already is vs X3. But well, if Egosoft want to do a console version there is no much we can do about it, i just hope that it end up to being a port of the pc version with stuff being reduced and adjusted.

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Post by tanner1ie » Fri, 4. Aug 17, 08:46

LTerSlash wrote:Im going to be honest here. I rather they dont waste any time intro Vulkan, to me it feels it takes just a huge amount of time just to get the same perf as DX.
i dont bite the "Doom-Vulkan" thing that just poor OpenGL perf on AMD cards.


That said, i have Ryzen 1700 + RX 580, so ill be probably the first one to see gains, but i rather they just focus on the gameplay.


Also i rather no PS4 support either, not because the PS4 cant run it, because i dont want the game to be dumb down to console levels more than already is vs X3. But well, if Egosoft want to do a console version there is no much we can do about it, i just hope that it end up to being a port of the pc version with stuff being reduced and adjusted.
Firstly there'd be no "dumbing down" needed to bring an X game or indeed the entire series so far to the PS4 or the Xbox 1 either, for that matter.

Like i mentioned, the PS4 has had several straight ports of PC games in recent years, and while due to Microsoft's relationship with other PC developers as well as being one itself, the Xbox 1 has gotten even more.
(Both system can easily run PC games - there's nothing "special" about the PC as a platform, nor the games released on it first :) .

On X4, i'm assuming it'll, even with the Vulkan stuff, it will still use the same base game engine and similar code to Rebirth as it's still relatively new and since it's only been used in one game so far, Egosoft will surely want to get their money's worth out of it and use it in at least one more game.
So i reckon X4 will have pretty similar system requirements to Rebirth if not exactly the same.

Therefore since Rebirth only required four gigs of ram (though it recommends 8 gigs), either way the PS4 would well run it, as it has 8, itself :) .

Even if the minimum amount of ram required to run X4 increased to 6 gigs, the PS4 still has plenty and though i doubt Egosoft will make it that or even would think of doubling Rebirth's required ram and make X4's minimum eight gigs, but even then, the PS4 has just enough.

Though if any PC game has required 8 gigs minimum or even 6 gigs yet, i haven't heard of it (sure plenty recommend that much, but i haven't heard of them needing it as a minimum yet - perhaps Star Citizen will be the first, if it ever comes out :) ), but either way even IF X4 required 8 gigs just to run, again as i said, the PS4 has just enough, but really since even many PC gamers don't have 8 gig systems to run the game themselves, i highly doubt they'd make the minimum ram as high as 8 gigs, if they even raise it above current games' 4... :) .
Last edited by tanner1ie on Fri, 4. Aug 17, 09:04, edited 2 times in total.
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Post by Miniding » Sat, 5. Aug 17, 12:23

I agree with you both...

LTerSlash is affraid that X4 will be Worth regarding the gameplay as XR is just because console need a gamepad!
I don't need a gamepad on PC but I must play with those gamepad menu in XR and that's a shame for me and a waste of time...

tanner1ie want's the whole serie on console... Sincerily why not?! But if you look closer to a PC running even X3TC, you'll understand there would be a dumbing down... Or at least a tunning down as X series are to eat RAM and GPU but you can't upgrade a console one. And all the threads to make the universe "living" are likely to be downgrade to be supported by consoles...

I know the PS4 is a great console but personnally, I prefer Ego Focuses on a great PC game like the old X was and don't miss the step of a good gameplay as they did for rebirth just to be close to a gamepad/console release...

IMHO, X is a PC serie and needs to stay this way to stay the kind of game the community loves. That said, if Ego wants to make a console one, Ok but don't miss the turn like for XR please....

Hope is up!
Miniding
X3 Reunion - X3 Terran Conflict - X3 Albion Prelude - X Rebirth - X4 CE...

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Post by CBJ » Sat, 5. Aug 17, 17:37

To clear up this debate, we are not actively working on console ports for any of our games at the moment.

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Post by NEMESIS165 » Sat, 5. Aug 17, 18:45

Can you put X4 for pre order on steam ? I will buy it .

just take my money

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Post by TVCD » Sat, 5. Aug 17, 20:48

NEMESIS165 wrote:Can you put X4 for pre order on steam ? I will buy it .

just take my money
X4 is not even in the alpha stage, first pictures or even info is also not yet and you want to pre-order? :roll: Nothing learned from Rebirth? :D First infos and pictures will be given by the Gamescom and then by the X-Con and then we see in which direction X4 develops. ;)
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Post by tanner1ie » Sat, 5. Aug 17, 23:27

Miniding wrote:But if you look closer to a PC running even X3TC, you'll understand there would be a dumbing down... Or at least a tunning down as X series are to eat RAM and GPU
Like i said in one of my other comments, i was still playing TC and AP on my nearly 13 year old Pentium 4 'til late last year, with its' 1 gig of Ram (and the one thing i didn't mention in the previous comment, a Nvidia 6200 "Turbocache"), aside from long loading times between sectors, the game still ran perfectly.
Reunion ran even between with zero loading times, but of course that game only needed half a gig of ram to run and recommended my old PC's 1 gig.

(I've no doubt a PS4 would run at the very least Reunion to AP, in it's sleep, surely even Rebirth because it well exceeds the game's minimum ram and matches its' recommended amount and EVEN if X4 doubled Rebirths' minimum ram requirement, which i highly doubt Egosoft will do with it as like i said even many PC players don't have 8 gig ram PCs.

While sure if people are buying expensive gaming PC these days, many will aim to buy systems with 8+ gigs of ram, but there are many people on a budget who still buy PCs with 4 gigs or less of ram*.

Long story short, power wise (and for any other reason), there'd be no need to downgrade or "dumb down" the series gameplay.

I want it EXACTLY the way it currently is (at least in all the entries up to and including AP (i've only run Rebirth a few minutes to see that it plays perfectly on my system, i haven't put any time into it to judge it for myself, i just know it disappointed a lot if other X fans.

Console gamers don't need simpler games either and are completely capable of playing and understanding the exact same games PC players play.

In 2005 i came to PC games directly from my PS2 and i could play and understand them instantly.
(While i CAN easily play PC games, it's the secondary problems you get with them that have me wishing i was playing them on a console.

First wondering if you can run particular games on your system, then if they'll run well, then changing game settings to find a nice balance between the game looking the best it can and running smoothly, then generally having to programme your own controller and other control options, if they even have controller support at all or good controller support at that, background programmes like anti virus scans or your system downloading an update and wanting to restart, not including them missing certain things we get on consoles like trophy support, easier placement of consoles in bedrooms etc.
Yes i know Laptops and Alienware Alpha are small, but they have limitations desktops PCs don't, so IF i have to have a PC to play certain games i still must have a desktop PC, but if all the games i want to play were available on a Playstation, which 95% of them are, i wouldn't even think of a PC as a gaming system... :) .)

On the flip side, as i've said, we've gotten direct PC ports of games like the aforementioned Elite Dangerous and in particular, its' easy to use button modifier control scheme is proff you don't need a keyboard to play complex space games like X with a controller.
(As i also said, i've played all the X games i've played with a controller on my PC, only using the keyboard for secondary functions, which i could have easily mapped to the controller, i just didn't bother to.

Elite's PS4 control scheme for example has one main function of each face button and typically three, if not more additional functions mapped to each button with modifiers, but you could easily map way more modifier functions, for example modifying a single face button with only the direction and shoulder buttons raises its' functions to nine, without even adding modifiers with the other face buttons or L3 and R3 or with two additional buttons, three additional buttons... though any more though four additional buttons would get extremely confusing...

If anyone remembers how factorial numbers work, there are literally thousands of button combinations possible with only the DS4's 12 standard buttons, not included those possible when you add L3, R3, Start, Share and the touch pad, though the ones after the main 12 would be difficult to press in combinations and sure while you literally wouldn't be able remember all the factorial combinations of 12 and likely run out of system memory programming them all and surely some combinations would (but maybe not :) ) cancel each other out by overlapping when pressing actually buttons, but the possible combinations of 12 numbers or indeed 12 objects is... 479,001,600 and while sure a keyboards' possible combinations is even higher, with the factorial of even only 20 buttons is 2,432,902,008,176,640,000, the primary point is, you don't need a keyboard to play a game like this :) .
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Factorial

(You could map at least nine functions to each of the face buttons.
One function for a tap, but upon holding it pick eight more functions for it by then pressing any of the four direction buttons or shoulder buttons, without even adding to that the additional modifiers of holding the same button, then pressing one of the other face buttons or combinations of buttons, such as the button with two other buttons, three other buttons. four other buttons and so on... :) .)

(*Many shop bought €300-500 desktop and laptop computers only come with 4 gigs of ram, the first starting model of the Alienware Alpha only came with 2 gigs of ram, while the second gen starting model still only came with 4 gigs of ram and cost around €650. While you can't currently buy the 4 gigs model from Dell, at least here in Ireland, and the first model of the Alpha currently which does indeed comes with 8 gigs of ram,... but it costs nearly €900 without a disc drive, which many people will still want to play older games which would push a starting Alpha with a disc drive up to nearly €950.

While the Alpha is of course a small and relatively powerful, because last time i heard you can't change its' graphics card once it's built, it can only use an external disc drive and worries some people have over its' cooling efficiency since it has such a small box, since Dell replaced its' pretty good value X51 line and aside from its' XPS line that offers some seemingly pretty random stock builds, some great, some terrible, but its' main gaming PC line now, the Aurora, is overpriced and not that impressive (without spending a fortune).

Its' starting build, without a disc drive and a pretty poor AMD RX 560 cost €1020, giving it a disc drive, which means changing the model to more expensive case and a still only average Nvidia 1050Ti makes the system cost €1230.
Adding a disc drive costs €50 extra and the different case needed another €50 extra.

The X51 models for about €800 were typically as good as the now €1200+ Aurora builds and 'til about three years ago came with disc drives as standard, but even in about the last two to three years 'til about a year ago when the X51 was discontinued and a disc drive was then an optional extra, adding it only cost €30 extra and didn't mean changing the case.

Most people are only going to buy €300-500 models, particularly if they're buying a family PC or only looking for PC as a secondary gaming device to a PS4 or Xbox 1, as i recently was.

While i was on a pretty small budget and i didn't like the often up to €600 PCs in shops like PC World, in the end i got my currently PC pretty cheap at €400 on sale from Dell, which while it indeed came with 8 gigs of ram and an i3 6100, it only came with an integrated HD 530 graphics but even with that its' able to run Rebirth at approximately medium settings and assuming X4's minimum settings don't change, it'll still run it too.
(It was down from €450, while their new similar system, with only a slightly better cpu and integrated card, an i3 7100 with a HD 630 is currently €500, indeed it's a direct iteration of my current PC... :) .)

If my PC will run Rebirth, my PS4 would surely run at least all the X games so far and hopefully still X4... :) .
Last edited by tanner1ie on Sun, 6. Aug 17, 00:31, edited 17 times in total.
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Post by tanner1ie » Sat, 5. Aug 17, 23:56

CBJ wrote:To clear up this debate, we are not actively working on console ports for any of our games at the moment.
I know you're not, i'm just wishing that you are or begging you to do so if you're not even thinking of it :) .

(I'm encouraged to think that your use of the words "not actively working on" mean that you're at least thinking of it or planning to...

...even if you were to release X4 and hopefully at least Reunion to AP on PS4 or any forthcoming Playstation in the next three to ten years, i'd be happy just to get it/them eventually :) .

I've been waiting nearly 13 years since i first discovered this series for a Playstation release of it and i just waited the best part of three years for the PS4 version Elite Dangerous, when i'd only heard a rumour it was coming to the PS4, while i've currently been waiting over two years for the European PS4 release of Kerbal Space Programme :) .

On PC ports on consoles while as i said in another comment we've gotten a decent amount since the release of the PS4, but in particular some high profile and a decent about of space games on the platform.

I'm hopeful the generally high quality and smooth transition to PS4 of most of them like Rebel Galaxy, Elite Dangerous and the sure joint PS4 and PC release No Man's Sky and their hopefully good sales, will have encouraged ye to develop for this console and indeed others :) .
(In other genre PC games that have come out on the system include, Tropico 5, Planetside 2, Blacklight Retrubution, War Thunder, World of Tanks, The Elder Scrolls Online, Warframe, while aside from third party developer Flying Tiger Entertainment messing up the post, Kerbal wounld run apparently run fine, while the Xbox 1 got Cities: Skylines in April, while we're getting it in two weeks.

All these games and more i could have played on my PC if i was forced to, but since i knew i'd soon have the option of playing them on my system of choice, Playstation, i waited for the them - if and hopefully when ye ever release X games on Playstation, you've some guaranteed sales here... :) .
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Post by tanner1ie » Sun, 6. Aug 17, 00:07

TVCD wrote:
NEMESIS165 wrote:Can you put X4 for pre order on steam ? I will buy it .

just take my money
X4 is not even in the alpha stage, first pictures or even info is also not yet and you want to pre-order? :roll: Nothing learned from Rebirth? :D First infos and pictures will be given by the Gamescom and then by the X-Con and then we see in which direction X4 develops. ;)
People supposedly turned in and had honoured 15 year old Duke Nukem Forever pre orders for new release copies when it finally released... so it's never too soon to pre order anything :) .

Not that i really do it myself or am saying that X4 will take as long to develop or be as disappointing as Duke Nukem Forever, it's just that they were some LONG before release pre orders (not that that was the plan of course with the game announced for PS1 then eventually coming out on PS3 :) .
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Post by kongha » Sun, 6. Aug 17, 09:46

Love the EA of the VR. Played the tutorial but then the game became crash prone (its because my pc isnt vr-ready so please reader have that in mind :) ).

What I did miss was the feeling of space beeing populated so please devs put some more npcs around stations.

Keep up the good work and thank you devs for creating such great games (x-rebirth was my first spac sim and now im hooked).

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