EnglishGermanFrenchRussianPolishItalianSpanish
Log inRegister
 
Khaak Invasions in TC ?
Post new topic Reply to topic
View previous topic :: View next topic
Author Message
Bill Huntington



MEDALMEDALMEDAL

Joined: 02 Feb 2009
Posts: 2384 on topic

Thank you for registering your game
PostPosted: Mon, 29. May 17, 17:20    Post subject: Khaak Invasions in TC ? Reply with quote Print

I'm wondering about the Khaak invasions in TC. They don't show up in AP, AFAIK. I've only noticed them early in game when I can't do anything about them. When I have enough to enjoy a good fight with them, I don't see them anymore.

Do these invasions continue through the game?

Is there a time interval between invasions?

Do they have a time limit or do the sector forces have to clear them?

I've only noticed them in important sectors. Can they appear anywhere?

Has anyone seen them in Terran space?

I'm talking about the Khaak when they invade a sector, not the ones that are part of plots.

Thanks.


_________________
Bill in S.F., enjoying the game
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
jlehtone



MEDALMEDALMEDAL

Joined: 23 Apr 2005
Posts: 16840 on topic
Location: GalNet BBS
Thank you for registering your game
PostPosted: Mon, 29. May 17, 19:11    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

X3R and X3TC had them. Couple Kha'ak Capitals and some fighters. I only remember an early one in X3TC, in Treasure Chest, that had conjured a container of many, large, expensive missiles. You know the "no money and no cargobay to capitalize"-stage of game. No recollection of seeing the invasions again and considering the nature of Xenon Hub plot there were some time to observe.

Perhaps two independent invasions within first 48 hours.

I don't recall seeing them "again" in X3R either, but some wrote that they did. In X3R they had the chance to linger longer, for sector defenses were weaker. There were also speculation that at some time the putative recurrent invasions would have hit the Kha'ak sectors, which obviously made them rather long-lasting.


_________________
Goner Pancake Protector X
Insanity included at no extra charge.
There is no Box. I am the sand.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Honved





Joined: 20 Jun 2010
Posts: 1084 on topic
Location: PA, USA, Terra, Sol System
Thank you for registering your game
PostPosted: Wed, 31. May 17, 15:27    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

Normally, most Kha'ak "invasions" involve 1-3 Kha'ak clusters, each with a Fighter and a group of Scouts. The Scouts tend to swarm and destroy any lighter ships they encounter, but are not match for any capital ship with serious anti-fighter weaponry, and are relatively weak 1:1. Those appear at irregular intervals throughout the game.

As for anything heavier, I've only seen Kha'ak Capitals on rare occasions outside of patrol missions, but they can appear, with or without an escort of smaller ships (or else the smaller ships have already been wiped out by the time the Corvette enters your sector).

If you do Operation Final Fury, they won't respawn.

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
zazie



MEDALMEDALMEDAL

Joined: 07 Mar 2005
Posts: 3268 on topic

Thank you for registering your game
PostPosted: Fri, 2. Jun 17, 14:54    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

I have found Kha'ak-Clusters on several occasions in the most remote Terran sectors (north-west-corner of the map and southwards of it). But I think they were triggered early in the game, it was not an invasion.

Bill, if you are interested to play an X-game WITH Kha'ak-invasions, go for XTC. There the Kha'ak are expanding (as the Xenon) and taking over "unknown sectors". You can even watch epic heavy battles between Kha'ak and Xenon when they try to expand into the same sector.

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Bill Huntington



MEDALMEDALMEDAL

Joined: 02 Feb 2009
Posts: 2384 on topic

Thank you for registering your game
PostPosted: Fri, 2. Jun 17, 22:15    Post subject: A speculation Reply with quote Print

Thanks for the replies, all. I hoped for more good info about the Khaak.

Let me observe a few things and offer an speculation. I notice a Khaak ship or cluster turns up from time to time when I enter a sector. If I reload many times the ship or cluster isn't there. I'll conclude that there's a Khaak probability calculation every time you enter a new sector; maybe it's there every time you enter any sector but with less probability after the first time. Now I'll speculate that the big Khaak invasions are just one possible result of the Khaak calculation. There's few big invasions because the probability is low. If true that would explain why they can be close together or further apart in time.

I only thought of this after I'd posted and gotten your replies. Thanks.


_________________
Bill in S.F., enjoying the game
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Nanook
Moderator (English)
Moderator (English)



Joined: 15 May 2003
Posts: 25799 on topic
Location: In the X-Universe spanning two millenia
Thank you for registering your game
PostPosted: Fri, 2. Jun 17, 23:11    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

Kha'ak clusters and Kha'ak invasions are two different animals. From observation and playing way too many hours of the game, Kha'ak clusters have a similar spawn algorithm to pirate patrols, but at a much lower rate. The spawns are usually triggered by the player entering a sector.

Kha'ak invasions are limited in number, and usually only appear early in the game ( at least that's the only time I've ever seen them). When they do spawn, it could be anywhere and totally unrelated to the player's location. Most occur in a populated sector and are usually dealt with by the locals before the player even knows they're there, including in Xenon sectors. So it's rare that the player encounters even one of them in any particular game.


_________________
Having an Acronym Attack? See the Ego FAQ. Also now for Terran Conflict and Albion Prelude.
NOT an Egosoft employee.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
RAVEN.myst





Joined: 20 Jun 2011
Posts: 2236 on topic

Thank you for registering your game
PostPosted: Mon, 5. Jun 17, 19:35    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

I, too, can only remember ever seeing those invasions (a page-full of red Kha'ak contacts in the contact list, ranging from Scouts all the way to a Carrier or two and/or a Destroyer or two) early in the game, and sometimes they were in highly inconvenient sectors - one time I remember it happening somewhere in the central Boron enclave (Great Trench, Lucky Planets, Light Water, etc), and having to make major detours to get around it. It even persisted for an inconveniently long time - and yet nowhere near enough for me to be able to... *enjoy* it... More's the pity. However, something Honved mentioned has made me wonder something: I typically do (well, DID - I tend to play AP these days...) Operation Final Fury early in every playthrough - perhaps that puts an end to the invasions? [This is something for me to try out in my next TC playthrough - in fact, it merits me starting one! Thanks, everyone Smile If I discover that not doing OFF allows the invasions to continue, I hope to remember to come back and report it ^^]


_________________
-
Any loose animals will be vaporized on sight.
-
Born on Lave, raised on Freeport 7...
-
The Write Stuff
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Snafu_X3





Joined: 28 Jan 2009
Posts: 3823 on topic
Location: London, UK
Thank you for registering your game
PostPosted: Wed, 7. Jun 17, 01:37    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

TC OFF certainly is reputed (read description) to stop Khaak invasions, but I don't remember encountering one in all my years of TC playing: maybe it's simply reduced from (say) 0.99% chance to 0.099% chance (or lower) in certain sectors.. I've no idea Sad I may have encountered the /remnants/ of one a few times (eg a lone Khaak destroyer or similar laying waste to a system), but I can't classify this as an 'invasion' of any kind, to my way of thinking..

Possibly once OFF is started the scale of invasions ramps up until it's completed.. but again I've never encountered even one in lots of game starts IIRC

One way of ensuring you're notified is to spam out satellites in every sector you visit (even better if you get an automated sat deployment setup with the appropriate Teladi s/w ofc). Hostile NPCs seem to target sats ASAP, so their destruction may give you enough early warning to jump there & take a look (& at least the log will show 'destroyed by..' details)

Alternatively, it may depend upon FIGHT rank. Since I tend to try to complete OFF with as low FIGHT rank (& therefore as soon) as possible (to avoid repercussions elsewhere, as well as the possibility of losing hard-won significant assets) that may also play a part..


_________________
Wiki X:R 1st Tit capping
Wiki X3:TC vanilla: Guide to generic missions, Guide to finding & capping Aran
Never played AP; all X3 advice is based on vanilla+bonus pack TC or before: AP has not changed much WRT general advice.

I know how to spell teladiuminumiumium, I just don't know when to stop!

Dom (Wiki Moderator) Cool DxDiag
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
RAVEN.myst





Joined: 20 Jun 2011
Posts: 2236 on topic

Thank you for registering your game
PostPosted: Wed, 7. Jun 17, 04:28    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

Snafu_X3 wrote:
I may have encountered the /remnants/ of one a few times (eg a lone Khaak destroyer or similar laying waste to a system), but I can't classify this as an 'invasion' of any kind, to my way of thinking..

Yup, those were probably such leftovers, as I don't think that lone Kha'ak capital ships ever spawn except because of plots (specifically OFF, methinks). Those lone destroyers were probably so belligerent on account of grieving the loss of all the friends they had brought with Razz Oh wait, no - perhaps it's because they are aggressive hostile aliens...

Snafu_X3 wrote:
Possibly once OFF is started the scale of invasions ramps up until it's completed..

Hmmm, an interesting notion. I don't know whether it is the case, but I would certainly like it if it is. Perhaps this merits some research... (I haven't played TC in some time - this is an adequate "excuse" to. As though I need an excuse! hah!) Very Happy

Snafu_X3 wrote:
One way of ensuring you're notified is to spam out satellites in every sector you visit

Indeed. Although as I recall, all my encounters with these Kha'ak invasion fleets happened before I was in a position to invest in masses of satellites (something that I tend to get started on ASAP.)

Snafu_X3 wrote:
... I tend to try to complete OFF with as low FIGHT rank (& therefore as soon) as possible ...

Same here, usually (except one time when I wanted to see whether I could ramp up the difficulty of OFF - turned out that no, it didn't, which was odd, as X3TC tends to scale things to the player's fight rank more than X3AP does, or at least such is my understanding...)


_________________
-
Any loose animals will be vaporized on sight.
-
Born on Lave, raised on Freeport 7...
-
The Write Stuff
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
jlehtone



MEDALMEDALMEDAL

Joined: 23 Apr 2005
Posts: 16840 on topic
Location: GalNet BBS
Thank you for registering your game
PostPosted: Wed, 7. Jun 17, 10:45    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

Cycrow wrote: https://forum.egosoft.com/viewtopic.php?p=3171544#3171544
In other words, the Kha'ak behaviour is hardcoded. Hidden in the binary.

That makes sense. Kind of. The X2 plot did provoke the Kha'ak, unlike the "native NPC" that are around all the time as "Jobs".

Both in X2 and X3R the plots and missions were in the binary. Cycrow says that the Kha'ak actions are still "in GoD", rather than ported to the Mission Director that has the plots and missions in X3TC and X3AP.

There are "Khaak Jobs" in X3TC. Possibly filtered by the GoD. I did not notice (or regognize) any "invasive pineapples" therein.


_________________
Goner Pancake Protector X
Insanity included at no extra charge.
There is no Box. I am the sand.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
RAVEN.myst





Joined: 20 Jun 2011
Posts: 2236 on topic

Thank you for registering your game
PostPosted: Wed, 7. Jun 17, 11:02    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

jlehtone wrote:
Kha'ak behaviour is hardcoded.

Ah, that explains the "discrepancy" - thanks for clarifying Smile Not that I mind, mind you - I prefer diversity; having exceptions to every "rule" in an expansive game such as these, makes things less predictable and therefore more interesting, in my opinion.


_________________
-
Any loose animals will be vaporized on sight.
-
Born on Lave, raised on Freeport 7...
-
The Write Stuff
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
jlehtone



MEDALMEDALMEDAL

Joined: 23 Apr 2005
Posts: 16840 on topic
Location: GalNet BBS
Thank you for registering your game
PostPosted: Wed, 7. Jun 17, 11:22    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

RAVEN.myst wrote:
less predictable and therefore more interesting

I do agree that to be good.

However, the TC/AP could have implemented that with Mission Director rather than kept it in the binary. Restrictive exceptions limit what modding can do. For example, every race could have the "aggressiveness flag". That would allow a plot to invoke various hazards. Imagine a sector demolished by a fleet of thousand Truelight Seekers ... Rolling Eyes


_________________
Goner Pancake Protector X
Insanity included at no extra charge.
There is no Box. I am the sand.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
RAVEN.myst





Joined: 20 Jun 2011
Posts: 2236 on topic

Thank you for registering your game
PostPosted: Wed, 7. Jun 17, 11:27    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

jlehtone wrote:

However, the TC/AP could have implemented that with Mission Director rather than kept it in the binary. Restrictive exceptions limit what modding can do.


Very true - accidental exceptions may turn out OK, but what you advocate is the ability to create/define exceptional behaviour - that would be far better, yes.


_________________
-
Any loose animals will be vaporized on sight.
-
Born on Lave, raised on Freeport 7...
-
The Write Stuff
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic Reply to topic
 
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum
Control Panel
Login Data
The time now is Mon, 23. Oct 17, 20:55

All times are GMT + 2 Hours


Board Security

Copyright © EGOSOFT 1989-2017
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
Template created by Avatar & BurnIt!
Debug: page generation = 0.58024 seconds, sql queries = 27