What a battle! Advice on Combat please.

[hisazul]

Skiron as best pre M7... is... just no. Hyperion makes all standard ships look sad and lame. Achinonix has stupid amount of forward firepower that nothing matches and 3-4 times more laser recharge then other m6 ships. Truelight seeker can mount capital weapons so yeah gauss cannon on m6 is a thing. There is nothing outside of shields that is note worthy about it, even then there are terran ships with even more shields and double shield reactor on top of that. It maybe be m6+with nol shortcomings but it also doesn't really shine in any one area or even as a general ship.

But in X3:TC, those ships can't be bought by the player or isn't in the game at all.
The Skiron is the best pre-M7 that is available to the player through buying.
I would say the crown is owned by the Springblossom, but that ship's lasergenerator lacks alot and will run out
almost instantly in a fight.
However.. speed is king. But you need to finish the Terran plot.

Ah right achinonix is AP only, okay I'll give you that but hyperion is not and can be fished too. Truelight is a plot ship, not hard to get just need to do the plot. In the interest of argument for a newer player it may be more beneficial to do plot then to waste what little cash reserves they have on buying an m6+ and then outfitting it. Springblossom is a good alternative to hyperion for a personal ship wouldn't really recommend it as a ship to rampage around xenon core sector just usual terran lack of good mid tier weapons.

Won't argue with tiger tho... That thing is a beast hands down. Aegir is probably the only other m7 I personally use but that is only because I tend to have easier time outfitting terran ships since I have more terran weapons and missiles but it is only more durable then tiger and severely lacks firepower and starbursts drain laser energy on it fast. As far as support for it goes that depends on what you are doing. If you are hammering a sector down then probably missile boats while you sit in tiger and swat away small fries or tanky ships to take some of the pressure off you while you shoot stuff.

Actually... there is agamemnon.... But it's very laggy and tends to mow down friendlies so it's one of those things you use once or twice for novelty's sake then put away. PSG is REALLY laggy, felt the need to say that again, was fun to do that last kha'ak mission in TC with it.

[Snafu_X3]

FWIW I played with the Springy in TC for a few weeks for lols, but eventually gave up & went back to Hyp

The Springy

• ..has a very limited cargo bay, so once you've equipped it with IS combat shields/weps etc it doesn't have much left over for fuel/missiles/ammo/loot
• Has an extremely limited NRG recharge, so the ESSC flak can only fire for a very limited time, reducing anti-fighter capability IS
• Has an understandably sluggish turn rate given its insanely high speed potential, making it problematic to use in dogfights
• Requires custom weps, which may not be (easily) available, especialy if you turn up at Aldrin late in the 'verse development
• has relatively low hull HP

OTOH it does make for a very effective (if expensive) Aldrin LT, once you transport the necessary equipment. Don't use more than 3 or 4 however: the Aldrin market will become saturated over time

The Hyp, OTOH

• ..is not so limited by wep/missile choice
• Relatively high hull HP - it's Paranid!
• Has double the cargo capacity
• Has a reasonable turn rate for an M6
• Has better NRG for shield/wep recharge & can thus be used as <playership> in most roles. (lack of flak availability may be countered with PSG/PBG if you're careful with friendlies)

What's not to like? Especially if you've an 'upgraded' Hyp from the relevant TC plot

I'm deliberately ignoring the Hyp's fighter bays: they're a bonus

[hisazul]

Instead of calling those 2 docking bays a bonus lets call it as it is. It makes some of the most annoying otherwise missions a breeze and requires no juggling of other ships. Because you can have a kestrel/etc parked with a spare JD. In AP with a jump beacon on top of that... it also comes as one of the better forward ships for dropping in a fleet, not the best... but none of the alternatives work feasibly as player ship or capable of doing most missions.

If you spend all the tuning boxes on that hyperion it also ends up being faster then most m3 ships... just as a bonus. In my current AP save my hyperion is at 450ish m/s with boosters I can outrun kestrel. I recall my TC hyperion was somewhere near 300 m/s after tuning.

Speaking of tunning reminded me of another "somewhat" plausible player combat ship for TC, assuming one spawned when you started the game. Kha'ak corvette, I do fully realize most people will not agree with it tho... it's is not a generally "good" player piloted ship period it lacks cargo, weapon choices, shielding etc and most importantly it depends on your luck for actually equipping it with weapons. Albeit it is probably easier in TC then AP. All that under assumption that it does spawn as abandoned ship in TC, I can't recall for sure... Hmm thinking more about it I don't think it actually spawns in TC... it is so much better in TC then AP due to weaker hulls in general. Ah well...

[Nanook]

FWIW I played with the Springy in TC for a few weeks for lols, but eventually gave up & went back to Hyp

The Springy

• ..has a very limited cargo bay...

The Springblossom has the second largest cargo bay of any M6 at 2000. Only the Hyperion has more at 3333 (not double! ). A lot of players actually use it as a LT/UT in Terran/Albion space because of its speed and cargo capacity.

[Snafu_X3]

My mistake: I was misremembering the Springy's cargo as 1K not 2K; however once reasonably equipped (ie shields) that's still a significant cut in available space for a player; as I said it makes an excellent OOS trader tho..

@Hiz: the Khaak Corvette is available to be boarded in TC; once you have 1 & the PHQ to RE it it makes a reasonable platform /if/ you can equip it

[Cpt.Jericho]

Due to its speed, the Springblossom only needs minimum weapons for trading. Very few ships can outrun it and those really don't need much firepower to blow. Full shielding should give enough survivabilty for it.
As for the Khaak corvette: Never captured one nor ever tried to do so. But I heard rumours that this ship is a real pain to dock IS. And it won't spawn as a derelict either in TC...

[jorganos]

Due to its speed, the Springblossom only needs minimum weapons for trading. Very few ships can outrun it and those really don't need much firepower to blow. Full shielding should give enough survivabilty for it.

I never give transport ships main lasers (unless I send them mining). Turret lasers for corvettes on transport duty are fine since they can fend off pesky pirates with some argumentative power.

The Spitfire does finde exerimental EMPCs in the six turret slots, and better with two experimental starbursts on the flanks and a bank of experimental EMPCs to the rear. Energy is more than sufficient for this type of armament.

If I fly a combat Springblossom, I will switch the main lasers between experimental EMPC and experimental M/AM-throwers. Either configuration has sufficient energy.
I usually switch off half of the frontal guns because the fire can be rather cross-eyed.

[hisazul]

Yeah I know for a fact it spawns in AP but TC I'm drawing a blank... and yeah manual docking with internal smaller docks is a 50-50 kind of deal. In some places it works and in some you just go boom... but autopilot as usual can dock and undock even if it goes inside station/ship etc so it's a nuisance but not much past that.

Spingy is the only trader you can use in Aldrin and expect things to happen this century

All that talk about wacky outfitting reminded me that I used mamoth to finish operation final fury in TC for the first time(my few capitals were .... not really of any use for that and I had no credits despite super high combat rank). Ahhhh the funny moments.

[Snafu_X3]

Docking problems only occur with supershipyards (internal docks for M6 ships & bigger), IME

[-John-]

Im close to purchasing a Tiger or Griffon. Ive stocked piled the weapons for each vessel (and shields). Also stockpiling Typhoons and Hornets.
Ive read the Griffon is a good ship for boarding;using, Ion Disrutors, what about the Tiger in this role?
I know,I will have to Train Marines and purchase a Cobra for Missle Pods.
But, boarding is still down the road a bit. (My last game,X3TC,this is when I stopped playing,boarding got me very frustrated;plus, real life got in the way).
I have thought about Typhoon Factories and maybe using my Traders to supply them;however, Ive never had/used factories and concerns about protection for them. They would be for my own use (of course).
But, anyway atm,Im down to either the Tiger or Griffon and can not make my mind up.
Oh and I would love to try out the Hype but I can not complete the mission capturing an L, hahahaha.
John

[hisazul]

My mistake: I was misremembering the Springy's cargo as 1K not 2K; however once reasonably equipped (ie shields) that's still a significant cut in available space for a player; as I said it makes an excellent OOS trader tho..

@Hiz: the Khaak Corvette is available to be boarded in TC; once you have 1 & the PHQ to RE it it makes a reasonable platform /if/ you can equip it

Bah missed your post entirely. So that's how you get one in TC, well no wonder I had such foggy memories about it. Hate boarding in X3 only do it so I can re-e a ship.

@-John-
Um... Again I seem to be drawing a bank but wasn't Griffon a mission reward in TC? Is this about TC or AP damn it... I'm so lost now. It was indeed more useful in TC then in AP tho... fighters were still worth it in TC. Problem with ID is that them frying things is random and they will never fry everything. But if I'm not mistaken it is just about the top ship for ID crippling in TC anyway. Ship also lacks ability to use missile pods boarding from it requires space walking which is... wonky to say the least. Ever tried to space walk xenon I in AP... if you can pull that off consider yourself a genuine god of boarding(only took me about 4 days... and I stopped playing for a year after that).

Anyway what Griffon was in TC is a unique M7C ship. In AP it was not unique anymore there are M7C for every race and most of them can carry more fighters and boron/paranid can carry TS/TP ship on top of that and have double the fighter capacity while you are at it. The big thing about Griffon in AP is 4x shielding of everyone else and more weapons then others but at the expense of much reduced cargo capacity. Tho it was still the most agile one I think having steering more in line with an M6 rather then M7.

If you want a M7 that will last or can cover more roles that will be Tiger hands down.

[-John-]

hello again hisazul. I am in AP. Thanks for the advice, I was leaning toward the Tiger. No,,I have no Griffon,no reward and guess that is from TC,as you mentioned.
Boarding,I will wait until I can get a Cobra and use boarding pods. I eventually will get around to training my marines. Something you may know or not know, I have around 5 captured pirates;did I read somewhere you can train the pirates into marines?
I ve been nailing Qs with my Centaur. At first I would launch 7 or 8 Typhoons on a Q, but now I can take one down without launching a missile.
Most times with no armor damage to my Centaur, sometimes I get sloppy.
Still learning how to strafe.
Hey, I gotta get back out in the yard,wife is looking for me,almost got busted. But, Im a real man.
Laters,
John

[Triaxx2]

Griffon IS a plot reward in TC, but I can't remember who from. I'm thinking Operation Final Fury. (But don't quote me.)

Alternately, I believe it's either buyable/cappable in AP, but I'm not sure there.

Personally I still say go Shrike for a personal Capital. Four Gauss Cannon's and 8 IBL's will win most fights. IBL's strip the shields, and the GC's pound the hull into so much scrap metal. A bit slow, but it's pretty well shielded, and anything that can catch it, can be defeated.

[ubuntufreakdragon]

Combat ships:
Fighters M4;M3
you can easily ignore cargo by buying a TM, too. This also allows mid-combat docking to refill your shields.
Important:
speed should be close to 200m/s or higher or you will be hit by pretty much all weapons.
A decent shield strength, 25 min but better 75 or higher
A decent weapons generator or ammo based weapons
low buy price
good choices Solano, Nova Raider
Corvettes M6
M6 need some but not much cargo
a good turret set is vital, your turrets need to take out enemies to fast for rotating the main guns
speed is less important do to stronger shields but it shouldn't be far below 130
you need good shields but the weapon choice is less important as long as there is one medium weapon you can use.
price is once again important because boarding a m6 is difficult without already owning one.
Good choice:
Springblossom: (espesially for AP)
extremely cheap for a m6
360m/s mean godmode, if you aren't to stupid
flak weapons so fighters a easily grilled
heave ammo based weapon
big cargo
downside:
terran ship so you need some reputation(in TC you have to play a whole plot for it to become available)
the weapon generator is pretty good, but no match for starbusts, use MAM and reduced starbust amounts to counter
Zentaur: because you get one for free in AP once you have it you can board a better m6 e.g. Hyperion
Hyperion not a good starting choice because you need to board it but with poisioned paranid start
than it's the strongest combat m6
bigships M7 M2 M1
for these the weapon layout and generator are most important
you need a good coverage with anti bigship weapons PPC IC IBL GC PSP and a good coverage with flaks flak cluster flak starbust psg also take some medium weapon like cig with you and enable automatic weapon switch.
good coverage means that at least 3 directions can mount these weapons.
and they should be small to get less hits
good choices
panther:
mini carrier with decent weapons
so you can decide whether you more which for a M2 or a M1
boreas
small extremely well armed fast for a m2

[hisazul]

Ah so we are talking AP. People confused me so hard with that. You won't go wrong with a Tiger then. There are options but this is a more popular one for a reason. Id still highly suggest using using Hyperion as alwaysAchinonix as your player ship, since this is AP. Achi looks balls awesome and it's really fast and can use boarding pods... oh and 12 main guns... YAAARRR!!! Cargo is... shit tho. That mission for achinonix is probably the best mission in X series hands down too. With a boat load of loot and tunning and weapons and so forth. Hyperion... well that is a subject that has been explained enough times to be nausiating, it's good, it's really good... and had no real shortcomings untill achinonix showed up with boarding pod capabilities.

I'm not much of an M7 user myself aside from m7m I only personally use aggy and aegir. Anyway, you should start preparing for next upgrade. Pteranodon. Another split ship but behaves nothing like an M2/m1 in general. The change is... DRASTIC. It's very maneuverable and you can easily dodge most of heavy hitting capital ship weapons plus it's a fair bit faster then other big boys. You do need to start working on getting 24 PALC... never mount PALC as main, long standing bug makes player shot PALC and any other "laser" aside from kha'ak do almost no damage, mount PPC. You will be able to drop Q's before they can even touch you. The other option is Kyoto but you need to not suck with PSP. Most people don't have patience to get good at it. But Kyoto is a real destroyer and it handles as such unlike Pteranodon.

Anyway... enjoy Tiger. You will be getting a lot of use out of it while farming PALCs for Ptera You will go through a lot of Q's and up before you finish collecting them. UFJD Qs are best but... it's UFJD... could farm space flies while you are there tho!