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Can't cap Carrack with my Cerebus
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Doktor Teufel





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PostPosted: Sun, 19. Mar 17, 15:28    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

jlehtone wrote:
More interestingly, the assets table lists 1 marine "In Space", but does not show name. I bet the game has failed to count the death (by ramming) properly. Thinking


Maybe he was rammed so hard that he got amnesia and can't remember his name.

The medical term for this condition would be "ramnesia."

Terrible puns aside, I've always felt that ion weapons in X3 come "pre-nerfed"—that is, with so many downsides loaded on to balance their special ability that they're hardly worth bothering with.

What's your take on that? Would you use them again for boarding?

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jlehtone



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PostPosted: Sun, 19. Mar 17, 16:57    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

Doktor Teufel wrote:
What's your take on that? Would you use them again for boarding?

If I want the ship, then yes. There are targets (Terran, Xenon) where any internal defense is an unnecessary risk.


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EagleTwoThreeX





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PostPosted: Sun, 19. Mar 17, 17:49    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

jlehtone,

One of my problems with flying the Cerberus was that after taking enemy shields down, I moved in to use the super short range IonD's and could not survive the time it took to 'kill' the targets (that damn Carrack Smile ) weapons, since I was so close it was hard/impossible to dodge his fire. And that was without it launching missiles...yikes.

After giving up on trying to fry weapons/internals for fear of their damage to boarding ship and marines walking, using a missile boat and pods makes it much easier, for now. I don't see myself trying to cap Terran, ever, and not Xenon until I get lots of experience. At that point, taking Xenon M7/1/2 would require internal frying, so I would think I'd have to use a tanky ship that can still mount IonD's. Would a Megladon work for that (cobra somewhere nearby to launch pods)? I was wanting to buy one anyway, but don't want to lose half cost if I end up selling it because it's balls.

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jorganos





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PostPosted: Sun, 19. Mar 17, 23:53    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

I find IDs to be quite problematic because of their tendency to "attack" the shields of neutral ships, especially when getting projected from the primary target(s).

They are quite efficient as anti-missile weapons, including your own pods, so I avoid using them when boarding. I usually have a few ships of varying durability equipped with a pair of them, maybe four. Keeping down the shields is usually left to pulse beam emitters, phased repeater guns or for bigger shields ion shard guns - usually also just pairs, in order to avoid unnecessary damage to the hull. Most of the time I use fighter drones to aid me in this. With more dangerous ships I use more drones and lots of wasps.

I find the ion shard railguns, ion pulse generators and ion cannon little different from the other weapons of the same classes.


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jorganos





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PostPosted: Mon, 20. Mar 17, 00:04    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

EagleTwoThreeX wrote:
After giving up on trying to fry weapons/internals for fear of their damage to boarding ship and marines walking, using a missile boat and pods makes it much easier, for now.

I don't let marines walk into turret fire - main guns are fine, though. But then I spacewalk only during salvage missions, when capping M7M, or when capping M6.


EagleTwoThreeX wrote:
I don't see myself trying to cap Terran, ever,

You can cap an Atmospheric Lifter with an M3+ and a pod slinger (doesn't need to have any flails or hammers, although that speeds the process up a bit). The only extension you must eliminate is the hull polarizer, the rest is manageable even with 4-star marines launched from pods.


EagleTwoThreeX wrote:
and not Xenon until I get lots of experience. At that point, taking Xenon M7/1/2 would require internal frying, so I would think I'd have to use a tanky ship that can still mount IonD's. Would a Megladon work for that (cobra somewhere nearby to launch pods)? I was wanting to buy one anyway, but don't want to lose half cost if I end up selling it because it's balls.


There is a trick where you combine a flak or cluster fluck array with ID to increase the range. You'd still be inside of flak range, which really hurts. Other than that, drone spam and wasp spam is a way to keep the turrets engaged with other targets than your frying ship.


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Doktor Teufel





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PostPosted: Mon, 20. Mar 17, 02:13    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

When in doubt, poop a hundred drones out, I always say.

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Jimmy C





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PostPosted: Mon, 20. Mar 17, 10:31    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

EagleTwoThreeX wrote:
At that point, taking Xenon M7/1/2 would require internal frying, so I would think I'd have to use a tanky ship that can still mount IonD's.


That's actually not a problem. If you scan Xenon ships "in the wild" as opposed to mission spawned ones, you'll find that they have practically no extensions fitted. Not even a jumpdrive and certainly not anti-boarding systems.

But that's the least of your worries boarding Xenon large ships. Zero-casualtiy boards are like 1-in-a-1000 events, even with the required 21 marines boarding, and even if they're all fully maxed. And you need 16 maxed hackers to crack the core, not 2 that would be enough for anyone else. You can consider yourself lucky if even 16 survive out of 21 boarders.

Should you launch reinforcements, you have already assumed at least that number of marines will die during the boarding. And you'd have to launch the reinforcements before the first wave cuts through the hull. Else, it will be too late. Should fewer than that number die, it's an even greater miracle than a zero-loss boarding.

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AleksMain





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PostPosted: Mon, 20. Mar 17, 12:38    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

X3:Albion Prelude

Capping with M7M has following

pros:
Quote:

+Boarding Pods are less likely to be shot down and give better synchronization of boarding personnel.
+Boarding pods also give an equivalent of double to the Mechanical Skill of personnel allowing bigger ships to be captured with less well trained personnel.
+ The speed of the Boarding Pods projectile also gains a boost based on the combined Mechanical Skill of personnel carried in the form of ƩMechanical Skill/4 +5 Engine Tunings added

+Range from the boarding ship give additional defense to attacking ship. From my own experience of boarding multiple Carracks: range about 8-10 km is suitable.

cons:
-Cost of the missiles and boarding pods.
-Missiles and boarding pods can be shot down by the enemy.


Calculating damage to shields: 1 Flail Barrage Missile = 5K x 8 = 40K damage, so for 2M shields about 50 Flail Barrage Missiles or more are necessary.

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Black_hole_suN





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PostPosted: Tue, 21. Mar 17, 06:09    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

EagleTwoThreeX wrote:
One of my problems with flying the Cerberus was that after taking enemy shields down, I moved in to use the super short range IonD's and could not survive the time it took to 'kill' the targets (that damn Carrack Smile ) weapons, since I was so close it was hard/impossible to dodge his fire. And that was without it launching missiles...yikes.
you can use a griffon instead of a cerberus. The griffon has the same shielding as the cerberus but is only 1/3 the of its sizeso its very easy to dodge bullets even at close range.. plus with proper positioning you could fire 10 IonD at that carrack.

or you could go for a more spectacular boarding op by using an M6 to fry internal systems of your target. Sneak into your targets blindspot then fire away with your weapons.. when the shields are down switch to laser like IonD, PAC, PBE, or a single flamethrower.. this type of boarding is what i always do using an overtuned Acinonyx

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Cycrow
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PostPosted: Wed, 22. Mar 17, 11:43    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

Jimmy C wrote:
And you need 16 maxed hackers to crack the core, not 2 that would be enough for anyone else. You can consider yourself lucky if even 16 survive out of 21 boarders.


A slight correction. You still only need 2 hackers for xenon ships. But just before the hacking stage, is the final battle to the core where you need a certain attack score to complete. If you dont have this, the mission fails.

for most ships, this is based largely on the remaining marines (if any) For Xenon ships, this is a fixed amount, and is equal to 16 max fighting marines (their hacking skill doesn't matter at this stage)


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Doktor Teufel





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PostPosted: Thu, 23. Mar 17, 14:24    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

Man, Egosoft wanted to make absolutely sure that you fight tooth and nail for that first I, huh?

Of course, once you have it, you've reached the pinnacle of your capping career.

I love the way the I looks notwithstanding its obscene power, so I'm in for a world of suffering (and a lot of missile complex building) as I embark on the adventure of nabbing one.

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Cursed Ghost





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PostPosted: Sun, 26. Mar 17, 01:55    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

Quote:
Terrible puns aside, I've always felt that ion weapons in X3 come "pre-nerfed"—that is, with so many downsides loaded on to balance their special ability that they're hardly worth bothering with.

What's your take on that? Would you use them again for boarding?


It very much depends if I don’t care about the ships equipment, then I'll use ion d's a good example of when this might happen is when I'm capping hyperons the equipment the Hyperion can equip is pretty common and easy to come by so no need to preserve it so striping it make sense as it makes capping easier since the Hyperion is one of the tougher m6s to board due to heavy shields and a fair amount of speed and firepower

If on the other hand I'm after a bigger prize like am m1/m2 then no because Ion d's don’t have enough range and simply aren't powerful enough for that I have other methods.

As for taking m7s it depends on what m7 it is for m7s I usually have 2 methods assuming I'm not using hammers and flails from an m7m

Method 1: Use Typhoons and CIG's drop the shields with Typhoons and when the shields get to about 10 % move in to 3km range and fire off a few controlled bursts from CIGs to keep the shields low enough for the boarding opp then remote launch my pods once there through the hull I'll back off and wait for them to do there thing

Method 2: if the ship is a Carrack or a Xenon Q I'll Exploit the blind spots on those ships drop the shields using Plasma Burst Generators which should take about 10 to 30 seconds this depends on the number of guns I have equipped and the shield strength of the target my typical setup will be 4 PBGs in weapon group 1 and 4 PBEs in weapon group 2 and weapon group 3 will be full guns

when the shields get to about 10% I'll switch to PBEs and control the shields while trying my best to stay in the blind spot then I'll launch pods and once my people are through the hull I'll back off to a safe distance and wait for them to do there thing

If you want to find the blind spot on the Carrack approach from behind and then go underneath the ship there is a small area there where the bottom turret can't shoot at you but you do have to be within about 500m so it does require some precision flying in a ship like the Hyperion this is quite easy as the ship is flat so I can get real close but your mileage may very depending on the ship you are in and even if I take a few hits its not to bad as the Hyperion is well shielded and the bottom turret only has 2 guns though you do have to watch out because some times it will be equipped with flak and trying this when equipped with flak is a really bad idea as flak will shred even a Hyperion in just a few seconds

If the ship has flak or it doesn't have a blind spot or the blind spot is to tricky to stay in then I'll use method 1

Boarding is one of those things that just require a bit if experience you have to know your target and the capabilities of that target or you will find Boarding to be a very frustrating experience even for players that are experienced with boarding sometimes things can go wrong and you will have to start again

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