Lost in Space, need "guidance"

zazie · Post by **zazie** » Tue, 10. Jan 17, 10:45

Hi guys
This is probably an embarrassing question, but I have not yet found a solution to my problem:
Related to a mission that might be broken, I decided to try another approach for getting to the zone in question: flying from [edited]"Torrid Veil" to [edited]"Glaring Truth" in free flight instead of using the [edited] Super-Highway. [On a side note: I still have the save before starting this 'expedition'. But before giving up I want to be sure that I can't beat the game ...]

This decision led to a rather long journey. The distance is more than 100'000 km (as I know now, dozens of IG-hours, my cash evolved from 800 mio to 3,2 bn in the mean time

).
My problem: it seems that the map-system of the game can't handle such long flights properly [edited: sector to sector-flights]. On the sector-map I have reached the position in the middle of the [edited] sector Glaring Truth. But I cannot see any sector or station nor can I 'plot' the itinerary to one of these stations (the guidance system leads back to Barren Heart).
I am aware of the 3D-character of the map and have cautiously "triangulated" my position [first loading the old save to compare the position of my ship before and after the trip], choosing distinctable objects in the background of the sector (as the broken highway in the south or similar objects), adjusting them with fixed points on the cockpit's window; from such a point I flew several hundred km in the directions up/down, left/right, forward/backward, in straight lines, always using external view to "look around" in the neighbourhoods of my ship (as I have learned several years ago in 'Freelancer' to find hidden stations or goods).

I had absolutely no success, can't find any station or ship.
I tried to call one of my own ships waiting in [not edited, correct] Darn Hot Air to "fly to my position", what should indicate the angle I have to search for the zone. But these ships flew to [edited] Barren Heart and started the same itinerary as I did => not helping.

So I am "lost in space", still living and not willing to give up. But I need some good advice. Any hints? Did I forget/ignore another approach?

edited after realizing that I had described the starting zone wrongly as Magma Pool and the destination zone as Darned Hot Air. The problem is not a inner-SECTOR-travel but a travel from Sector to sector without using the superhighwas. My apologies !

RAVEN.myst · Post by **RAVEN.myst** » Tue, 10. Jan 17, 12:27

OK, that's most bizarre - something is broken (are you running any mods?) because the distance between Magma Pool and DHA is only a few dozen kms, not 100,000 - the trip should take only minutes.

Regarding the "3Dness" of the map - have you tried rotating it so that you can see whether you are above or below? (I think it's hold-right-mouse-button to do this - was added in a patch, I think about "halfway" between release and these days...)

zazie · Post by **zazie** » Tue, 10. Jan 17, 13:19

pure Vanilla, 4.0.

I do not know it but it seems possible to me that Magma Pool and Darned Hot Air are different than other adjacent zones. When I started in Magma Pool I could fly for a long time along those asteroids in the northern part of the zone. For a long time I could see in the distance the yellow line of the highway; in the same time I observed that I slowly proceeded along the atseroids, leaving some behind me while others appeared far ahead.

Another clue for a long-distance journey: the sun itself in the beginning (viewed from Torrid Veil/Barren Heart) is a not-too-big-yellowred spot in the middle of the screen. The same sun in DHA/Glaring Truth is HUGE, far bigger than from Barren Heart. As hte journey took so long, I could see that the diameter of the sun is proportional to the distance (smaller when further away, growing when approaching); there was no sudden 'jump'. So as a player I really got closer to that sun.

"Rotating" - not sure about that point. But I can confirm that I have reached a point where I can "dive" into the white field of the radar-screen (I was too high up first). I thought this would be the ecliptic meaning that I perfectly match with the ecliptic.

STOP - I just realized that my description of the starting point was WRONG. That was not Magma Pool but Torrid Veil in Barren Heart! I have edited my post above. I am sorry, RAVEN.myst!

RAVEN.myst · Post by **RAVEN.myst** » Tue, 10. Jan 17, 13:36

zazie wrote: That was not Magma Pool but Torrid Veil in Barren Heart!

Heheheh! I was going to mention that I've made the trip "on foot" between DHA and all the nearby zones in GT (sometimes with SETA, sometimes without), but your last comment makes it academic

Yes, you were trying to fly between sectors "on foot" - I very much don't recommend that!

ubuntufreakdragon · Post by **ubuntufreakdragon** » Tue, 10. Jan 17, 15:14

one question: why? if you want to evade plot triggers there are easier ways like sitting in a bigship and ordering it to refuel

.

Post by **Ketraar** » Tue, 10. Jan 17, 15:34

I may be mistaken, but can you fly between sectors without the use of Super Highways? Its been a while, but I have a memory entry in my brain claiming its not possible.

MFG

Ketraar

RAVEN.myst · Post by **RAVEN.myst** » Tue, 10. Jan 17, 15:38

Ketraar wrote:I may be mistaken, but can you fly between sectors without the use of Super Highways? Its been a while, but I have a memory entry in my brain claiming its not possible.

MFG

Ketraar

I also don't think it's just "a very long way", but in fact downright impossible. (I may be mistaken, though...)

Post by **Sparky Sparkycorp** » Tue, 10. Jan 17, 15:39

Have you tried setting your target zone as the autopilot's destination? It may indicate what direction to fly in. At least as long as you're over halfway there it might.

zazie · Post by **zazie** » Tue, 10. Jan 17, 17:05

@ubuntufreakdragon: no specific reason. Just do it-mentality. But I tested how far away from the gates you may still find crates (surprisingly far away)

@Sparky Sparkycorp: Yes. It still works. But the autopilot aims for the last gate/last zone I have flewn through = Torrid Veil/Barren Heart, not my destination. (And as said before: plot course does not work either)
@Ketraar/RAVEN.Myst: If flying between sectors is impossible that'd be a bummer ...

But you might be right: If I open the map of sector Glaring Truth, my ship seems to be in the middle of the sector. If I move the ship about 100km I am far off the remotest zone of GT (and no indication of Empty Zone or similar). If I travel south, off the GT's sector map, and open the map of Sector Barren Heart, my ship's location on that map seems to be northeast of the place where the blue line of the Superhighway fades into black (when zooming).

Post by **Alan Phipps** » Tue, 10. Jan 17, 17:28

Heh, somebody asked almost the same question a long time ago and didn't really get much further towards a clear answer there either.

Post by **Ketraar** » Tue, 10. Jan 17, 17:59

zazie wrote:@Ketraar/RAVEN.Myst: If flying between sectors is impossible that'd be a bummer ...

I just asked about the ability to fly between sectors in XR and the asnwer was

no

Which is good, as it means my memory banks are still working OKish.

MFG

Ketraar

Post by **UniTrader** » Tue, 10. Jan 17, 18:24

Ketraar wrote:
zazie wrote:@Ketraar/RAVEN.Myst: If flying between sectors is impossible that'd be a bummer ...
I just asked about the ability to fly between sectors in XR and the asnwer was
no
Which is good, as it means my memory banks are still working OKish.

MFG

Ketraar

i had a scripting accident a while ago where a capship i observed from on board was boosting between sectors, and even though it took a long time the sector context changed properly when i arrived near the target zone without additional measures (just using <move_to> for boosting) . well, might be a diffrent situation from flying with the Skunk itself...

zazie · Post by **zazie** » Wed, 11. Jan 17, 18:42

Thanks guys for your contributions, special thanks to Alan Phipps for that link.

When I read MutantDwarf's "Even if you could travel to those places without using the super highway, you wouldn't be able to do so within your lifetime. " I asked myself if I'm still alive

Cannot do it right now but will do it: take screenshots from that journey.

My conclusion is (and somehow as my answers to questions in that linked thread of 2013) :
It is possible to travel 'by foot' from sector to sector in the sense that there is no wall. But even if the map indicates that you are in the other sector or if you reach a position where the other sector should be, the game will not show/reproduce this other sector. The other sector is only 'produced' if the engine is triggered by the player using the respective Super-Highway.

I don't think that this was intended by Egosoft (well, with those guys you never know ...) but it'd be an interesting philosophical discussion along some lines inspired by some of the best quotes from [the TV-series]"Life":
- I am here in Sector X. I travelled here all the way and during a veeery long time in my ship. The map and the geography prove it. But the sector is not here.
- I am not here in the Sector, but the Sector is here. The map proves it.
- I am not NOT here in the sector, I came in by SuperHighway. And there is the sector.
- Where am I?

OK, back to serious attitude: My sense of explorer led me deep into space, it seems that I reached a point where the game mechanics do not properly work any more. I am lost in space.

Two options: travelling back some 120'000 km along the still working guidance - or reload.

Post by **UniTrader** » Wed, 11. Jan 17, 18:45

if you have a capship yo can call it to your position and then jump with it

or, if you have, simply use the jumpdrive.

spankahontis · Post by **spankahontis** » Wed, 11. Jan 17, 21:07

In the Past I tried to fly to one of the Major Asteroids on the outskirts of Ascendancy and all I got was a 'Danger Entering Atmosphere' warning followed by death.

Maybe it's like that in all directions?

Post by **UniTrader** » Wed, 11. Jan 17, 21:17

nope. in fact you can even fly out of the skyedome given enough time and/or overtuned boosters*. celestailbodies have a "kill zone" of 100km aoround them though. (and a 150km warning zone) (and all background objects count as celestialbodies)

* could also be that i skipped through the killzone of the skydome with my overtuned boosters.. not sure..

zazie · Post by **zazie** » Wed, 11. Jan 17, 22:35

The ship I had called to fly to my position mentioned in the OP was a cap ship. But as I saw that it moved to Barren Heart and started to move towards me from there I stopped it. I did not want to wait sooo long (its engines are only 3x faster than the Skunk).
But it looks that this is the better option than to reload.

I do not have the JumpDrive yet.

As far as the sun in Glaring Truth is concerned: I never got a "Danger Entering Atmosphere"-warning. I have been extremely close to the surface, far below the magnetic plasma flares; but I think that the warning-zone would belong to the sector Glaring Truth that I have not triggered before.

RAVEN.myst · Post by **RAVEN.myst** » Wed, 11. Jan 17, 23:14

zazie wrote:... quotes from [the TV-series]"Life"...

How bizarrely synchronous - I re-watched that series about a week ago

Or did I...? You have placed me in an existential quandary!

zazie wrote:"Even if you could travel to those places without using the super highway, you wouldn't be able to do so within your lifetime. "

Now that I think about it: the in-game character statistics show distances travelled by superhighway (which are several order of magnitude greater than any others), so that suggests that the space may, indeed, be simulated on some level/in some manner. EDIT: Also, there are cases in Omicron Lyrae (due to its radial layout), where the route between a station and its "nearest" mining location ends up not where one would expect - for example, in Radiant Haven looking for ice, the miners will go to Path of Glory in Eclipse Clouds, instead of stopping at Last Stand, thus well more than doubling the distance travelled. I suspect this is because the "nearest resources" is being calculated "as the sparrow flies", and if so, that would also suggest a coherent, unified system space.

spankahontis wrote:In the Past I tried to fly to one of the Major Asteroids on the outskirts of Ascendancy and all I got was a 'Danger Entering Atmosphere' warning followed by death.

What, not even a tee-shirt? On a more serious note: I tried a similar experiment, also in Ascendancy, but I guess I'm less patient - ended up turning around (in retrospect, I could have simply cloned myself ie. saved the game, and then simply reload when I'd had enough - I guess I was too immersed for such meta, at the time

) I didn't know that Rebirth also has that warning (which I've heard aplenty in Split Fire, and less often in some other sectors in previous Xs) - good to know, thanks

zazie wrote:I have been extremely close to the surface, far below the magnetic plasma flares.

Well, talk about "to boldly go where no man has gone before". "Don't split your infinitives" (I forget where that's from, sorry.)

sd_jasper · Post by **sd_jasper** » Thu, 12. Jan 17, 03:29

I would try setting auto-pilot on something, then move to your crew quarters... let the ship travel for a bit and then return and see if things have fixed themselves.

Rei Ayanami · Post by **Rei Ayanami** » Thu, 12. Jan 17, 05:40

zazie wrote:My conclusion is (and somehow as my answers to questions in that linked thread of 2013) :
It is possible to travel 'by foot' from sector to sector in the sense that there is no wall. But even if the map indicates that you are in the other sector or if you reach a position where the other sector should be, the game will not show/reproduce this other sector. The other sector is only 'produced' if the engine is triggered by the player using the respective Super-Highway.

That seems to be the way it is, yea.
While you can fly from one sector location to another sector location manually it won't trigger the loading of the assets of the sector you flew to.

Maybe with X4 they can do something like:
-give every sector a 500km large invisible trigger sphere
-if the player manually flies from sector X to another sector Y and enters the trigger sphere of sector Y:
--unload assets from sector X
--load assets from sector Y
--set players "current sector" to sector Y

egosoft.com

egosoft.com

Lost in Space, need "guidance"

Lost in Space, need "guidance"