Looking for ship design variety added to [3.0] ... thoughts.

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Nosfuratu79
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Looking for ship design variety added to [3.0] ... thoughts.

Post by Nosfuratu79 » Wed, 22. Oct 14, 00:33

I from what I have learned so far playing X-rebirth, I would like to see more ships added to the data base, A simple request and easy addon with 3.0 around the corner..

1. New ships xenon ships with tactical Ai attack strategies

2. Carriers, with Drones and Drones. Aka* air craft carriers *

3. Repair ships for stations and Other Ships.. that can add drones on the fly or repair when greatly needed.

4. Super freighters, that can store X amount of multiple goods of various types. * big long * slow moving Cross galaxies Super freighters * with trade drones that can trade between other ships or stations if you looking to horde and collect. Example: Metal plating and space weed ;)

5. * New Skunk ships designs * If we are going to be stuck in one ship please give us different models to choose from * unlock-able after story line progression maybe ?

6. New trade ships and capital ships.

Please devs look at x3 * Variety of vast ships is what pulled me in
* was so excited to play X rebirth because I was looking forward to the ships and what they can do among other things.

look forward to responses!
Jayson
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werewolves?
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Post by werewolves? » Wed, 22. Oct 14, 01:10

Frigates! Frigates! Frigates!

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Post by InDigital » Wed, 22. Oct 14, 19:27

I agree with that:)
Actually i am surprised how it is possible this game has 6 gigs no more... Terran Conflict was about 8 and more Gigs but it was older game.

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mr.WHO
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Post by mr.WHO » Wed, 22. Oct 14, 19:43

It would be nice to have supply/repair ship that would be deployable like construction ship, could have two docking ports (when deployed) for big ships and could transfer cargo/drones/equipment/fuel/make repairs.


Other ships that are missing:
- Canteran frigate
- Canteran Carrier (might be to much for pre-Gate connection Canterans, but as player jumpstart their economy they could come up with their own carrier)
- maybe 1 or 2 more Canteran fighters (same story, sfter their economy improve they should come with more military grade fighters, not junk)
- Xenon Frigate
- Omicron Lyrae Frigate
- Omicron Lyrae Carrier


Having these would fill all current gaps - "the frigate gap" is the most obvious one, because using destroyers for general patrol duty is a bit overkill, while Balor is more like attack/bombardment frigate.

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Post by SyberSmoke » Wed, 22. Oct 14, 20:55

Hurm...yeah I agree that the different groups could use more ship variety. The Canterans do need more coverage. But more then that I believe that that AI should receive a strong pass and beating with the smart stick.

Right now with how ships fight...many of the otherwise good ships (Balor and Sucelus) are gimped by an AI that can not use them properly.

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wysiwyg
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Post by wysiwyg » Wed, 22. Oct 14, 21:05

Yes there is a bit of a shortage of craft size somewhere between the larger medium ships (Katana, Daito, gigurum) and the smaller L size freighters such as the Styrvok. The Balor is really the only "frigate" class ship in the game ATM.

I would also like to see a refuelling barge and some passenger transports that can ferry staff around.

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BigBANGtheory
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Post by BigBANGtheory » Wed, 22. Oct 14, 21:35

everyone loves a dreadnought or planet killer :twisted:

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Nosfuratu79
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Post by Nosfuratu79 » Wed, 22. Oct 14, 22:20

I agree with all the statements here, the game can be lack lusted when it comes to Ship designs, X3:tc Had So many ships to choose from and use!

Carriers <----- everyone wants
Repair ships <----- needed for stations and other ships
Skunk Models Different ones <--- gives a gamer options and we like that stuff.
Super freighters or Cross galaxies trading barges <---- say XXL ship size.
Who doesn't want to see some Massive ship come out of Hyperspace ?!

Egosoft care to comment ? I am sure these ideas have reached your table before ?
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MegaJohnny
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Post by MegaJohnny » Wed, 22. Oct 14, 22:48

werewolves? wrote:Frigates! Frigates! Frigates!
This is my top wish too for ships.

I don't know why, but there's something so endearing about small warships like frigates. The Balor is pretty specialised so a more general purpose frigate would be nice to see.

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Post by Jaxartes » Thu, 23. Oct 14, 00:00

I'd really want to see ships with new mechanics like a ship that can repair others or some ships that disable other ships subsystems electronically for afar but is lightly armed itself. Or at least specialized ship, like xl missile boat like a big balor or a ships with lots of flak weapons for anti fighter defense.

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Nosfuratu79
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Post by Nosfuratu79 » Thu, 23. Oct 14, 06:52

like in X3:TC We need ships that match each race, Not the Same ships copied and pasted, How did the X rebirth team decide to use the same ships or every race ?, I know there not lazy. I dont understand there decision making on this, Please design new ships X-team. its so dull and gray * snif snif *
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Post by Earth Ultimatum IV. » Thu, 23. Oct 14, 15:28

I would classify Balor as a mini M7M, not as a M7 frigate...

I want to see more conversions of old ships.
Currently we have the Xenon M, L and the Katana. Also the split Mamba, Scorpion and Raptor.
Skunk might count as a conversion from previous games too, as it was in Albion Prelude ending.

I would love to see my favorite M2 and M1s back from previous games.
Titan, Osaka, Tokyo, Brigantine, Galleon, Phoenix... Also the old-styled Xenon i.

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Post by linolafett » Thu, 23. Oct 14, 15:58

Modeling fighters takes days, modeling frigates takes weeks, modeling capitals takes months. Aside of the modeling, all the setup/malancing/jobs and texts have to be set up. If you want also new features, as you propose, it will take even longer, ai has to be coded.
This is probably enough to answer your questions, but let me explain a bit more :)


We had the XXXL ship discussion here often enough. Problem with 10km long ships or even longer is: As soon as you start rotating such a ship, the ends of it will move faster than any ship can fly. That is not cool and there is not really a solution to this. Everyone in poximity of the ship will get smacked around.
Why do we need such huge ships, when even fully build stations are smaller than them? Their cargobays would be always empty, there is not enough to transport.
Sure they look awesome on first sight, but are not worth the trouble in my opinion. More smaller ships are more important imo.

Everything what you propose is sadly out of reach for the next update.

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Post by Jaxartes » Thu, 23. Oct 14, 16:21

linolafett wrote:Modeling fighters takes days, modeling frigates takes weeks, modeling capitals takes months. Aside of the modeling, all the setup/malancing/jobs and texts have to be set up. If you want also new features, as you propose, it will take even longer, ai has to be coded.
This is probably enough to answer your questions, but let me explain a bit more :)


We had the XXXL ship discussion here often enough. Problem with 10km long ships or even longer is: As soon as you start rotating such a ship, the ends of it will move faster than any ship can fly. That is not cool and there is not really a solution to this. Everyone in poximity of the ship will get smacked around.
Why do we need such huge ships, when even fully build stations are smaller than them? Their cargobays would be always empty, there is not enough to transport.
Sure they look awesome on first sight, but are not worth the trouble in my opinion. More smaller ships are more important imo.

Everything what you propose is sadly out of reach for the next update.
I do kinda agree on the XXXL ship thing. I think the fulmekron is about the largest a ship should be in the game.

linolafett
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Post by linolafett » Thu, 23. Oct 14, 16:26

Even the Fulmecron created way too many issues with docking, that a little bit smaller would be my preferred maximum size. Something up to 3,5 km would be okay (for trading ships). Big Destroyer may be able to be a little bit bigger, as they do not have to dock at the tradeoffers at stations.

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Post by Terre » Thu, 23. Oct 14, 16:29

linolafett wrote:Modeling fighters takes days, modeling frigates takes weeks, modeling capitals takes months. Aside of the modeling, all the setup/malancing/jobs and texts have to be set up. If you want also new features, as you propose, it will take even longer, ai has to be coded.
This is probably enough to answer your questions, but let me explain a bit more :)
"malancing" ?

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Post by mr.WHO » Thu, 23. Oct 14, 19:13

mr.WHO wrote: Other ships that are missing:
- Canteran frigate
- Canteran Carrier (might be to much for pre-Gate connection Canterans, but as player jumpstart their economy they could come up with their own carrier)
- maybe 1 or 2 more Canteran fighters (same story, sfter their economy improve they should come with more military grade fighters, not junk)
- Xenon Frigate
- Omicron Lyrae Frigate
- Omicron Lyrae Super Carrier


Thinking little more about it I came out with an idea to have a "specialised frigate for most of big factions":

Canteran Escort Frigate:
strong points:
- good anti fighter weapons (HIT/MA, Hailstorm/MA, astrobee launcher)
- fastest of all frigates
- bit stronger than averge frigate shields

weak points:
- no anti-ship weapons
- very ligh hull (to reduce mass for fast speed)
- no drones

Background:
This is pre-gate connection ship used to repel Reviers fighter raids and to escort other ships on longer trips. No anti-ship capabilities needed because when Reivers pull out a Tirurel Canterans just counter with Sullecus.

OL battle frigate:
strong points:
- ballance weapons, but tipped to anti-ship. Two turreted beam cannons mounted on the nose with 270 degree coverage, so they can fire front, side and almost to the back. Additionally 4 side plasma turrets, suplemented by some hailstorms/MA and HIT/MA
- ballanced hull/shield, but tipped to hull

weak points:
- faster that OL destroyers, but still slow
- no drones
- expensive

Background:
OL goverment designed this ship after increase of Xenon attack that made a conclusion that OL destroyers are too slow to effectively respond to Xenon attack, while lighter ships and fighters are overwhelmed by AIG forces. They needed a something faster, smaller that could better react to this thread, but still be able to hold on it's own against combined ship-fighter Xenon force till reinfocements arrive to contain the situation.

Xenon G
strong points:
like the original Q it should mount good anti-ship firepower on a resonably strong and fast hull

weak points:
- main weapon turrets should be easy to disable, so it's a glass cannon.





Other ships
Canteran Escort Carrier
Post-gate connection design - ships base on Terran drone carrier from Albion prelude. The story is that the canterans had blueprints for this ship for long, but they didn't see the poin to put their limited resources. With connection of DeVries to other systems and economic recover this ship is avaliable to build in Canteran shipyard and slowly put into Canteran military (after the plot point when Canterans fully mobilize against PMC)

strong points:
- cheap and smaller than Sul (aimed to be replaceble and expendable)
- fastest of all carriers
- good anti-fighter weapons (HIT/MA, Hailstorm/MA, astrobee)
- can carry up to 80 drones

weak points:
- smaller than average drone hold.
- no anti-ship weapons.
- weak shields and hull

Canteran Shinobi Heavy fighter
Post-connection and latest Canteran fighter constructed using latest Albion technologies. Performance and weapons wise this ship should be on par with best Albion fighers, but bit weaker hull/shield and faster and more agile.

Canteran Hiroshima Assault fighter
Post onnection Canteran redesign of old Teran Claymore bomber (so it's the size of Katana). Knowing that their capship are weaker than PMC ships, Canterans decided that the fastest and cost effective way to solve this problem is to introduce dedicated anti-ship fighter that is slow, but has improved hull and shields as well as good weapons (heavy cannons and dual V crushers rockets)

Omicron Lyrae Super Carrier
Separated from main Argon space, Omiron Lyrae goverment decided it's not cost effective to maintain the Arawn class. To reduce maintenance cost they designed news super carrier based on Fulmekron hull (entire front section replaced by drone hangars).

Strong points:
- strong hull and shields (comparing to Fulmekron it has stronger hull, but weaker shields)
- biggest drone hold (300) and launch capabilities (twice as Arawn)
- Strong anti-fighter weapons (Hailstorm/MA, astrobee launchers)
- two side beam turrets (to repel lighter ships like frigates)
- Novadrone launchers (but half the capability of Balor frigate) to support battle from distance

Weak points:
- even slower than Fulmekron
- more expensive than Fulmekron (and this not include additional cost of 300 drones)
- engines and heavy weapons are fragile and can be disable easily


I know this might be too much for Egosoft at the moment, but maybe some modders would be willing to implement these ideas.

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Sandalpocalypse
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Post by Sandalpocalypse » Fri, 24. Oct 14, 13:06

it's not actually that hard to slap some more guns and such on an existing model, the modding system is really nice that way.

works well for Canterans since it fits their slapdash ethos.

I was experimenting with some frigate variants like this back in 1.3 or so but integrating them into the game properly is a lot of work (as linolafett mentioned xD)!
Irrational factors are clearly at work.

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Post by Felix Adama » Mon, 27. Oct 14, 13:05

The Canterans do have a frigate sized ship in the Stromvok already. This is a similar design and size to their trading ships. It preforms alright against a Titurel, especially with a bit of aid from the skunk! Costs around 10M-11M from the shipyard in DV. I haven't seen any RoC ones flying around, only my small fleet that mainly gets tasked to station defense.

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Sandalpocalypse
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Post by Sandalpocalypse » Mon, 27. Oct 14, 16:15

i was leaning a little smaller actually, but w/e. they didnt have that stuff back in 1.3, i do like the Stromvok though. It's got attitude~
Irrational factors are clearly at work.

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