[SCR] OOS Combat Rebalance (alpha 0.32 - 06.08.10)

Igor.tverd · Post by **Igor.tverd** » Tue, 2. Nov 10, 12:27

Gazz, which MARS script files OOS re-balance require? Does it require an installed version of MARS or only certain script files from it? Thank you in advance.

Gazz · Post by **Gazz** » Tue, 2. Nov 10, 12:29

Technically only the setup/config/library script files but these would install all empty buttons which might crash the game when the connected scripts are not present.
Try it if you feel lucky.

There's no harm in having MARS "fully" installed whether you want to actually use it or not.

rusky · Post by **rusky** » Tue, 2. Nov 10, 17:40

Gazz wrote:As I said, fast lasers are assumed to have a much higher chance to hit so their DPS is used with a much higher factor than something like PPC.
(which is realistic...)
The DPS values you see there are only the "true" base data as MARS uses them.

Exactly, which is why I am surprised to see that my ship, armed with the "fast" lasers that have more "base" dps to boot, and twice the shields, barely wins against a ship armed with mostly regular ppcs.

For some reason, after the calculation, my ship has almost 12k less dps o0
as you can see in my previous post.

EDIT: I did some in game testing, both IS and OOS and I guess that it's fairly accurate after all, assuming both ships stand next to each other and just fire it out

PS: I'm still curious though. Does having a lot of ships factor in properly ? So if i have 5 M7's will i be able to destroy an M2 without losing any or will it just be a series of 1v1s until the M2 dies of attrition ?

h2o.Ava · Post by **h2o.Ava** » Fri, 19. Nov 10, 06:28

This is what I did to have OOS without MARS.
Completely install MARS.

open script editor and remove this line from plugin.gz.mars.uninstall:
set global variable: name=gz.mars.config value=null

then run plugin.gz.mars.uninstall all arguments = null

save
quit

delete setup.plugin.gz.mars.xml

play

now you have the full global variable: gz.mars.config
and OOS without mars

Canterous · Post by **Canterous** » Sun, 21. Nov 10, 23:22

Is this compatible with cmod4, SRM, and IR?

mr.WHO · Post by **mr.WHO** » Sun, 21. Nov 10, 23:45

Yes it is.

paulwheeler · Post by **paulwheeler** » Mon, 22. Nov 10, 09:42

Make sure you use the MARS data provided in the CMOD4 main post, otherwise this will use vanilla damage values.

foszae · Post by **foszae** » Sat, 27. Nov 10, 02:43

longtime MARS user, returning to X3TC. and damn, i'm sorry i didn't notice this one before. has made quite a significant difference in my OOS losses. wow, do i hope you are making scripts for TNBT

Ashitaka-san · Post by **Ashitaka-san** » Tue, 14. Dec 10, 12:02

This looks like a very interesting script. Look forward to trying it out in the near future as I am getting more OOS combats occurring and have been getting a bit frustrated with the results.

Keep up the good work.

Bobucles · Post by **Bobucles** » Tue, 14. Dec 10, 13:54

Is there any chance you'll make a "slowed down" version of OOS combat? Since you can't force the game to give you smaller time steps to work with, an alternative option is to simply drag out combat to have more time steps. This gives players more time to intervene in OOS affairs, without altering the way players see combat too much. The biggest change would be to the amount of time ships have to retreat or to reinforce a fleet.

Gazz · Post by **Gazz** » Tue, 14. Dec 10, 16:38

Bobucles wrote:Is there any chance you'll make a "slowed down" version of OOS combat? Since you can't force the game to give you smaller time steps to work with, an alternative option is to simply drag out combat to have more time steps. This gives players more time to intervene in OOS affairs, without altering the way players see combat too much. The biggest change would be to the amount of time ships have to retreat or to reinforce a fleet.

Bullet time for OOS combat?
Doable? Yeah.
Strange? Indubitably. =P

Fights involving player ships can be postponed by x seconds easily. The combat scripts wouldn't know and the ships keep circling each other - or rather freezing in space when OOS.

The tricky bit is that there is no battle entity that can be postponed. Any and all OOS combat happens strictly between two ships.
So the only sure way to do this would be to delay every single shot / missile fired by or against a player owned asset.
That would make your defending / static ships rather useless because by the time they are allowed to fire, the enemy is out of range again.

Bobucles · Post by **Bobucles** » Tue, 14. Dec 10, 16:56

Gazz wrote:
Bobucles wrote:Is there any chance you'll make a "slowed down" version of OOS combat? Since you can't force the game to give you smaller time steps to work with, an alternative option is to simply drag out combat to have more time steps. This gives players more time to intervene in OOS affairs, without altering the way players see combat too much. The biggest change would be to the amount of time ships have to retreat or to reinforce a fleet.
Bullet time for OOS combat?
Doable? Yeah.
Strange? Indubitably. =P

Fights involving player ships can be postponed by x seconds easily. The combat scripts wouldn't know and the ships keep circling each other - or rather freezing in space when OOS.

The tricky bit is that there is no battle entity that can be postponed. Any and all OOS combat happens strictly between two ships.
So the only sure way to do this would be to delay every single shot / missile fired by or against a player owned asset.
That would make your defending / static ships rather useless because by the time they are allowed to fire, the enemy is out of range again.

You could also reduce damage across the board. This way, a complete battle takes extra turns to resolve. This could bring up certain issues with shield regen, but it'd take a huge damage decrease to bring that to light. Something like half or 1/3 damage should still allow for proper casualties, without ending battles in mere seconds.

Some other methods may include providing a full damage first salvo, such as starting combat with two "turns" of fire. This would represent the ship having a strong initial salvo, with reduced laser energy as the battle progresses. Combine both ideas (1/3-1/2 overall damage, with 2-3x first salvo), and you have a high initial punch that slows down with intense combat. After a minute or so out of combat, the ship is "charged" and ready for another opening salvo.

"OOS Bullet time" is a pretty accurate assessment. Watching dots disappear on a map is cool... But who wants to jump into a major battle just to find a pile of wreckage?

Gazz · Post by **Gazz** » Tue, 14. Dec 10, 17:30

I had been toying with things like that before but didn't have the nerve to deal with side effects like OOS fights taking too long to resolve that they'd build up a queue...
Fight scripts (even in their simplified OOS mode) are among the most involved scripts of all, checking all kinds of things every "turn".

nap_rz · Post by **nap_rz** » Thu, 6. Jan 11, 13:02

so I would only need to drag and drop the script in the \scripts folder? same for uninstallation?

100% work on saved games and all mods/scripts?

Nafensoriel · Post by **Nafensoriel** » Mon, 7. Mar 11, 10:01

Just a curious question since I'm not entirely sure what I broke..
All large ships suddenly cannot target anything smaller than an m6 yet they can still be fired upon successfully. I watched a 4 hour fight between an Agamemnon and an elite OOS while trying to figure out what fu happened where.

Even knocking back to stock weapons and respawning the ships doesn't seem to fix the issue.. The only successful thing I've found to fix it is basically using the stock fight.std scripts.. I cannot physically get an M7 to actually fire on an M4.. very frustrating. Any help would be appreciated.

Sinnerman264 · Post by **Sinnerman264** » Tue, 8. Mar 11, 21:03

Sounds like a great thing for immersion hunters!

I believe it should work well and blend nicely with SRM + CMOD?

orion84 · Post by **orion84** » Fri, 18. Mar 11, 08:26

Nafensoriel wrote:...All large ships suddenly cannot target anything smaller than an m6 yet they can still be fired upon successfully...

Now its happening to my Tokyo and a pirate octopus.. anyone find a workaround?

Locksley · Post by **Locksley** » Fri, 18. Mar 11, 10:42

Hello,
If someone can answer a few questions.

EDIT - Never mind the non dmg. I got logging going with numbers but there must be something wrong with my computer or how I did the debug thing. I just removed the comment marker in Exscriptor since I could not figure out the right way to add it ingame script editor.

But it practically locks up my computer? And I have not read anyone else having such an impact on a high grade machine.

So what is the right way to activate debugging?
END EDIT

I enabled logging to check what is happening in my game.
As been noted before it did incur heavy lag - 0.1 FPS.
In the logs I can't find any damage values being distributed!

As the lag is very heavy I turned off the game after 1 sec ingame time - 5 min in the "real" world. So maybe no dmg because there where no time for OOS combat to truly activate?

I got MARS installed and adjusted to accept 43 laser from the new CMOD4 release.

My quad core 9650 is running at 4.2GHz (watercooling is a great thing)

EDIT!---> Re-installed and it does now give me dmg data. I wonder....
But still the lag is incredible with logging - how bad should it be?
END EDIT

EDIT2 - And then I re-install again on my main game. And again there is no dmg. And there was no message that OOS was upgraded to v33 (even though I been using the same). I'll do a third re-install and see if it will activate. I wonder what it is I am doing wrong

END EDIT2

Some data from the logs:
log01337

Code: Select all

2869;AM5CK-31;Argon Recon Discoverer Explorer;Get config data;Main Ver;32;My Ver; 32;Var;GZ.OOSD.SHIP.DATA;Data;ARRAY ( ARRAY(4), ARRAY(4), ARRAY(4), 32, 4003, 3038, null, null, ... )
      Battery  0  Light   ARRAY ( 0, 0, 0, 2839 )
      Battery  1  Medium  ARRAY ( 0, 0, 0, 2839 )
      Battery  2  Heavy   ARRAY ( 0, 0, 0, 2839 )
2869;XM6JI-03;Xenon PX;Get config data;Main Ver;32;My Ver; 32;Var;GZ.OOSD.SHIP.DATA;Data;ARRAY ( ARRAY(4), ARRAY(4), ARRAY(4), 32, 4188, 3093, null, null, ... )
      Battery  0  Light   ARRAY ( 0, 0, 0, 2869 )
      Battery  1  Medium  ARRAY ( 0, 0, 0, 2869 )
      Battery  2  Heavy   ARRAY ( 0, 0, 0, 2869 )

log01338

Code: Select all

2893;IM1TJ-72;Pirate Syndicate Galleon;ATTACK;Perdition's End;PM6HH-56;Paranid Escort Patroclus
2893;IM1TJ-72;Pirate Syndicate Galleon;add battery;2;shield DPS;0;hull DPS;0;pierce DPS;0;sec left;30;Effectivity Perc;60
2893;IM1TJ-72;Pirate Syndicate Galleon;add battery;1;shield DPS;0;hull DPS;0;pierce DPS;0;sec left;30;Effectivity Perc;100
2893;IM1TJ-72;Pirate Syndicate Galleon;add battery;0;shield DPS;0;hull DPS;0;pierce DPS;0;sec left;30;Effectivity Perc;110
2893;IM1TJ-72;Pirate Syndicate Galleon;total damage;Shield;0;hull;0;pierce;0;t.size.class;1;sec;30
2893;PM6HH-56;Paranid Escort Patroclus;No laser battery for counterfire
2893;SM5GI-95;Split Recon Jaguar Explorer;ATTACK;Ghinn's Escape;IM4DM-51;Pirate Elite
2893;SM5GI-95;Split Recon Jaguar Explorer;add battery;2;shield DPS;0;hull DPS;0;pierce DPS;0;sec left;30;Effectivity Perc;10
2893;SM5GI-95;Split Recon Jaguar Explorer;add battery;1;shield DPS;0;hull DPS;0;pierce DPS;0;sec left;30;Effectivity Perc;60
2893;SM5GI-95;Split Recon Jaguar Explorer;add battery;0;shield DPS;0;hull DPS;0;pierce DPS;0;sec left;30;Effectivity Perc;100
2893;SM5GI-95;Split Recon Jaguar Explorer;total damage;Shield;0;hull;0;pierce;0;t.size.class;0;sec;30
2893;IM4DM-51;Pirate Elite;No laser battery for counterfire
2893;XM6II-97;Xenon PX;ATTACK;Menelaus' Paradise;BM3ZK-88;B. Border Control Barracuda Vanguard
2893;XM6II-97;Xenon PX;add battery;2;shield DPS;0;hull DPS;0;pierce DPS;0;sec left;30;Effectivity Perc;10
2893;XM6II-97;Xenon PX;add battery;1;shield DPS;0;hull DPS;0;pierce DPS;0;sec left;30;Effectivity Perc;60
2893;XM6II-97;Xenon PX;add battery;0;shield DPS;0;hull DPS;0;pierce DPS;0;sec left;30;Effectivity Perc;100
2893;XM6II-97;Xenon PX;total damage;Shield;0;hull;0;pierce;0;t.size.class;0;sec;30
2893;BM3ZK-88;B. Border Control Barracuda Vanguard;No laser battery for counterfire
2893;BM3NI-20;Boron Matriarch's Freight Transporter ;ATTACK;Xenon Sector 472;XM2FI-42;Xenon K
2893;BM3NI-20;Boron Matriarch's Freight Transporter ;add battery;2;shield DPS;0;hull DPS;0;pierce DPS;0;sec left;30;Effectivity Perc;100
2893;BM3NI-20;Boron Matriarch's Freight Transporter ;add battery;1;shield DPS;0;hull DPS;0;pierce DPS;0;sec left;30;Effectivity Perc;110
2893;BM3NI-20;Boron Matriarch's Freight Transporter ;add battery;0;shield DPS;0;hull DPS;0;pierce DPS;0;sec left;30;Effectivity Perc;120
2893;BM3NI-20;Boron Matriarch's Freight Transporter ;total damage;Shield;0;hull;0;pierce;0;t.size.class;2;sec;30
2893;XM2FI-42;Xenon K;No laser battery for counterfire
2893;KM3MN-12;Kha'ak Fighter;ATTACK;Njy's Deception;SM5GI-89;Split Recon Jaguar Explorer
2893;KM3MN-12;Kha'ak Fighter;add battery;2;shield DPS;0;hull DPS;0;pierce DPS;0;sec left;30;Effectivity Perc;10
2893;KM3MN-12;Kha'ak Fighter;add battery;1;shield DPS;0;hull DPS;0;pierce DPS;0;sec left;30;Effectivity Perc;60
2893;KM3MN-12;Kha'ak Fighter;add battery;0;shield DPS;0;hull DPS;0;pierce DPS;0;sec left;30;Effectivity Perc;100
2893;KM3MN-12;Kha'ak Fighter;total damage;Shield;0;hull;0;pierce;0;t.size.class;0;sec;30

log01339

Code: Select all

2878;XM3MI-00;Xenon LX ;Print THIS CF;Entries;1
2878;XM3MI-00;Xenon LX ;PreCF THIS;Index;0;Teladi Escort Falcon Vanguard;Distance;38;Same Env;null
2878;TM3DJ-76;Teladi Escort Falcon Vanguard;Print Target CF;Entries;0
2878;KM5CM-38;Kha'ak Scout;Print THIS CF;Entries;0
2878;PM5HH-54;Paranid Recon Pegasus Explorer;Print Target CF;Entries;22
2878;PM5HH-54;Paranid Recon Pegasus Explorer;PreCF Target;Index;21;Kha'ak Scout;Distance;0;Same Env;1
2878;PM5HH-54;Paranid Recon Pegasus Explorer;PreCF Target;Index;20;Kha'ak Scout;Distance;0;Same Env;1
2878;PM5HH-54;Paranid Recon Pegasus Explorer;PreCF Target;Index;19;Kha'ak Scout;Distance;0;Same Env;1
2878;PM5HH-54;Paranid Recon Pegasus Explorer;PreCF Target;Index;18;Kha'ak Scout;Distance;0;Same Env;1
2878;PM5HH-54;Paranid Recon Pegasus Explorer;PreCF Target;Index;17;Kha'ak Scout;Distance;0;Same Env;1
2878;PM5HH-54;Paranid Recon Pegasus Explorer;PreCF Target;Index;16;Kha'ak Scout;Distance;0;Same Env;1
2878;PM5HH-54;Paranid Recon Pegasus Explorer;PreCF Target;Index;15;Kha'ak Scout;Distance;0;Same Env;1
2878;PM5HH-54;Paranid Recon Pegasus Explorer;PreCF Target;Index;14;Kha'ak Scout;Distance;0;Same Env;1
2878;PM5HH-54;Paranid Recon Pegasus Explorer;PreCF Target;Index;13;Kha'ak Scout;Distance;0;Same Env;1
2878;PM5HH-54;Paranid Recon Pegasus Explorer;PreCF Target;Index;12;Kha'ak Scout;Distance;0;Same Env;1
2878;PM5HH-54;Paranid Recon Pegasus Explorer;PreCF Target;Index;11;Kha'ak Scout;Distance;0;Same Env;1
2878;PM5HH-54;Paranid Recon Pegasus Explorer;PreCF Target;Index;10;Kha'ak Scout;Distance;0;Same Env;1
2878;PM5HH-54;Paranid Recon Pegasus Explorer;PreCF Target;Index;9;Kha'ak Scout;Distance;0;Same Env;1
2878;PM5HH-54;Paranid Recon Pegasus Explorer;PreCF Target;Index;8;Kha'ak Scout;Distance;0;Same Env;1
2878;PM5HH-54;Paranid Recon Pegasus Explorer;PreCF Target;Index;7;Kha'ak Scout;Distance;0;Same Env;1
2878;PM5HH-54;Paranid Recon Pegasus Explorer;PreCF Target;Index;6;Kha'ak Scout;Distance;0;Same Env;1
2878;PM5HH-54;Paranid Recon Pegasus Explorer;PreCF Target;Index;5;Kha'ak Scout;Distance;0;Same Env;1
2878;PM5HH-54;Paranid Recon Pegasus Explorer;PreCF Target;Index;4;Kha'ak Scout;Distance;0;Same Env;1
2878;PM5HH-54;Paranid Recon Pegasus Explorer;PreCF Target;Index;3;Kha'ak Scout;Distance;0;Same Env;1
2878;PM5HH-54;Paranid Recon Pegasus Explorer;PreCF Target;Index;2;Kha'ak Scout;Distance;0;Same Env;1
2878;PM5HH-54;Paranid Recon Pegasus Explorer;PreCF Target;Index;1;Kha'ak Fighter;Distance;0;Same Env;1
2878;PM5HH-54;Paranid Recon Pegasus Explorer;PreCF Target;Index;0;Kha'ak Scout;Distance;0;Same Env;1
2878;KM5CM-43;Kha'ak Scout;Print THIS CF;Entries;0

Anything happening here? I can't see any DMG.
If the lag is so heavy on my game with logging on in would be totaly stuck on a slower computer. So what can I have done wrong?

Will also try a re-install.

Thanks for your time

Cheers!

HotSake · Post by **HotSake** » Fri, 18. Mar 11, 16:13

Try saving and loading a few times. OOS and MARS both take two or three loads after installation to fully initialize, I think.

Locksley · Post by **Locksley** » Fri, 18. Mar 11, 21:00

Yeah, will do that.

What about the lag? Does it rend everybody's game almost un-responsive? As I wrote, I get one frame every 30sec and I got a pretty darn good computer.

I believe I did not activate the logging in a correct manner; but I do get the logging. I just edited it in Exscriptor. What exact commands are one to use? I am too poor a scripter to even know what command is the right one

EDIT - Also I can't find any mention of a OOS script running or being called in the script window?
---> Found it; called once. Should not the OOS plugin be called everytime there is a fight? END EDIT

I can't say I notice any slowdowns untill I try to enable logging.

Cheers!

egosoft.com

egosoft.com

[SCR] OOS Combat Rebalance (alpha 0.32 - 06.08.10)