[SCRIPT] Dedicated Assistant Drones (DAD) V4.7 [03.05.2009]

[Gazz]

One point to consider is the blast radius of the different types. Your apparently default spacing distance of 1km. is probably ideal in that respect.

SQUASH mine: 1620m blast radius
(applies to all mines AFAIK)

Btw, what is the top speed of the tracker mine? (which of course determines their usefulness vs. M4-->M5 classes)

0 m/s and they are extremely deadly vs M4.

All mines have a detection radius of 700-750m.

No mine has friend/foe recognition so all of them are practically useless unless temporarily and/or against specific targets.

My old TRACKER mine script fixed the F/F issue so it was actually possible to use and maintain minefields.

[pelador]

One point to consider is the blast radius of the different types. Your apparently default spacing distance of 1km. is probably ideal in that respect.

SQUASH mine: 1620m blast radius

Thanks Gazz I'll adjust the spread to 1,250 m

Using a^2 = b^2 + c^2 means they will be 1768m at closest arrangement in the star.

This means a emulated sphere of influence with radius 1,250m. Or diameter = 2,500m.

[Gazz]

BTW: Do you have plans for a coffee drone? You seem to have everything else covered by now.

Personally I think those cloaked drones are a bit much.
(I assume you temprarily assign neutral/friendly race)
Drones are tiny targets and it's already unlikely that they are intercepted but making them completely non-targetable isn't fair.


All in all you seem to be aiming for maximum power with no drawbacks whatsoever. Well, not counting credits which are trivialized in the later game.

I found that the only useful balancing factors are tactical issues and consequences that the player can't simply avoid with a quick reload.
One of the most important balancing factors is letting the AI use these features as well.
Like shooting a mine layer drone towards the playership...

Mind you, I'm not claiming that all of my scripts were always balanced.
The TRACKER mine script had a SQUASH catapult that would toss proximity fused mines in the general direction of enemy fighters.
Practically instant death for whole fighter wings. No way to survive this.
I never found a good way to balance that abomination so I didn't port it to TC.
I just got ahh... more careful from blunders like that. =P

[pelador]

BTW: Do you have plans for a coffee drone? You seem to have everything else covered by now.

Personally I think those cloaked drones are a bit much.
(I assume you temprarily assign neutral/friendly race)
Drones are tiny targets and it's already unlikely that they are intercepted but making them completely non-targetable isn't fair.


All in all you seem to be aiming for maximum power with no drawbacks whatsoever. Well, not counting credits which are trivialized in the later game.

I found that the only useful balancing factors are tactical issues and consequences that the player can't simply avoid with a quick reload.
One of the most important balancing factors is letting the AI use these features as well.
Like shooting a mine layer drone towards the playership...

Mind you, I'm not claiming that all of my scripts were always balanced.
The TRACKER mine script had a SQUASH catapult that would toss proximity fused mines in the general direction of enemy fighters.
Practically instant death for whole fighter wings. No way to survive this.
I never found a good way to balance that abomination so I didn't port it to TC.
I just got ahh... more careful from blunders like that. =P

If you want a delivery drone to bring you coffee I'm sure I could develop one for you.

Not all drones have the camouflaged ability. In the case where a camouflaged drone would bring unneccesary unfairness I wouldn't apply its use.

So far the drones that have Camouflaged skills are:


1) Spy - Only an delivery system, and the resulting satallite it deploys is still open to attack.

2) Mine Layer - Same issue as Spy only a delivery system, but questionably arguable if fair to deploy static mines secretly.

3) EMP - Drone, required for enemy targets and its effects are limited to smaller than M7/M6 and only their systems.

4) Turret Drone - Only a delivery system again. Same questionability as Mine layer.

5) Blitz drones - required for effective delivery, very expensive, limited impact to defences. If marines where targeted more in their delivery process their might be an equivalent argument.

6) Hacking Drone - again sensibly required for its purpose. More expensive than pirate missions (in most cases more than double).

7) Sniper Drone - required for black ops or enemies. Questionble fairness but costs again are higher than using guns to effet a bail and are expendable. In relation to a second hand sale they are probably equivalent. So costs associate a balance here, hence why I kept them expensive.

8 ) Privateer Drone - They dont really have an unbalancing effect, only provide easier info.

9) Collection Drone - I dont see it as a major problem to allow undisturbed collection, the drones are relatively slow, so allow little ordinance leverage in the heat of a dynamic battle situation. If drops where more abundant and with higher tech then it might potentially become more of an issue.


Cargo bay shielding is required for the camouflaged ability whether bought or custom made and is in limited supply. The engineering process I have supplied to help this however is in limited numbers and requires a number of resources (some rare) with engineering periods, all of these factors to control overuse.


The drones themselves have limitations if bought due to the differences in more complicated tech requireing longer production times and small stock numbers otherwise you have to source tech resources (some with long production times, low availability and low stock as a consideration to balance) to custom fit them and then they also have in some cases atmospheric wares as extra control. If a player spends time setting up a lot of infrastructure to better make use of the custom drones I wouldn't want to penalise them for making tech possibilities more open to them.

The bought drones also vary availability by faction/race and in some cases require expensive software or devices, some involved in custom construction.

However, I'm open to debate as to wether I have applied effective balancing in this process and am ready to adjust any of their many balancing factors that are incorporated into the process if identified as a problem.

[Gazz]

Still I wonder how often a sniper drone is used against the player.
There is no hostile ship warning because it's neutral, there is no attack... just a little blue dot scurrying across the gravidar and then the game over screen.
EMP could also be quite crippling although not an instant game over.

IMO a system is balanced if a ship (like the playership) has a fair (or at least any =) chance against it.
If that's not the case it's just another I-Win button.

[pelador]

Still I wonder how often a sniper drone is used against the player.
There is no hostile ship warning because it's neutral, there is no attack... just a little blue dot scurrying across the gravidar and then the game over screen.

IMO a system is balanced if a ship (like the playership) has a fair (or at least any =) chance against it.

Would not the pirates or Xenon use hacker drones to make your OWP or laser towers friendly?

The sniper drone is not a guaranteed success, if you read the drones in detail you may begin to realise just how much thought I do put into "balance". I'm not saying I have it "tweaked" right but its in there.

Interesting notion about allowing AI to use them, I may consider this as a future idea for AI possibilities even if it means adding to the population of the X-Verse to a small amount.

Back to the coffee drone however, I do understand your point about too many becoming cumbersome or complicating. So far I have tried to make the application of the drones user freindly with applied menus/sub-menus. I wont be doing drones till I die, however. And have other project ideas for consideration in the future also, but for now the focus is drones.

[DIGSIN]

The EMP mod uses a modification of TwareT file which is limited to negligable volume. A pity as I wanted to develop my own balancing characteristics with volumes with the various drones. I sent a request to LV about practicalities of changing volumes, yet to get a responce, but I imagine its a non-starter with TwareT. But modding my own other Twares file would represent a shift to a more modded orientated development that begins to raise compatibility issues with other developments. Hence I chose the EMP mod as it is intended as a community resource to avoid potential conflicts and easier to manage as resources have been identified for its use. As a result hard to use EMP for OWP wares.

The EMP was originally set up in order to help scripters add extra resources to the X games. Normally when scripters add items they are additions to the actual ship, so don't often need to add anything into the cargo bay, hence, they are all set to a volume of 0 on some occasions they will add buyable items into the stations (LV's hull repair for X3R, i cant remember if this used any cargo space or not).

Reading through this thread you are producing new Drones of various uses, so yes, i think they should use cargo space (volume).

I am not a scripter, so i need to know, is it not possible to change the volume used by script?

If this is a definite no, then i am prepared to adjust the volume of certain entries when v2 is released, this should help you to keep using EMP and not force players to have to decide which scripts they wish to install.

[pelador]

The EMP mod uses a modification of TwareT file which is limited to negligable volume. A pity as I wanted to develop my own balancing characteristics with volumes with the various drones. I sent a request to LV about practicalities of changing volumes, yet to get a responce, but I imagine its a non-starter with TwareT. But modding my own other Twares file would represent a shift to a more modded orientated development that begins to raise compatibility issues with other developments. Hence I chose the EMP mod as it is intended as a community resource to avoid potential conflicts and easier to manage as resources have been identified for its use. As a result hard to use EMP for OWP wares.

The EMP was originally set up in order to help scripters add extra resources to the X games. Normally when scripters add items they are additions to the actual ship, so don't often need to add anything into the cargo bay, hence, they are all set to a volume of 0 on some occasions they will add buyable items into the stations (LV's hull repair for X3R, i cant remember if this used any cargo space or not).

Reading through this thread you are producing new Drones of various uses, so yes, i think they should use cargo space (volume).

I am not a scripter, so i need to know, is it not possible to change the volume used by script?

If this is a definite no, then i am prepared to adjust the volume of certain entries when v2 is released, this should help you to keep using EMP and not force players to have to decide which scripts they wish to install.

This would be an ideal solution all round and open availability to users for wares that I have used. At present I have identified future expansion but others may drop into the pot. But I doubt this will exceed anywhere like 20 to 25 wares in total for the development. I'm trying to use the wares for more than just one purpose also to limit numbers.

I did ask LV about using scripting techniques to adjust values but didnt get feedback he was more concerned with the numbers I wanted to use in the EMP list, which is justifiable. So at present my understanding is the script engine is focussed around the Tware definitions for best application. Pseudo code could be used to emulate validations but only complicates the scripting process and may not easily identify all associated problems doing it that way, and wouldn't apply best practice with standard proccesses. I have a spreadsheet with definitions ready, so if these can be catered for its very good news, tyvm.

[DIGSIN]

TwareT has roughly 200 extra entries in it, so i can understand LV's concerns about how many entries you wish to use, it looks like you need 10% of the entries.

The EMP is a straight conversion from the X3R EMP originally made by AalaarDB, i may look into seeing if i can add more entries to it, if this is feasible, how much work would it be to change the entries you have used to new ones?

[pelador]

TwareT has roughly 200 extra entries in it, so i can understand LV's concerns about how many entries you wish to use, it looks like you need 10% of the entries.

The EMP is a straight conversion from the X3R EMP originally made by AalaarDB, i may look into seeing if i can add more entries to it, if this is feasible, how much work would it be to change the entries you have used to new ones?

I'm not a confident modder, but have suggested entry definitions ready for use. If TwareT can apply volumes and cargo classes then I would assume it to be a case of adding in their index numbers and their associated page 17 id reference as identified by EMP.

Currently have 17 definitions (which identifies current expansion needs), so I would be happy with 20 total if possible.

[DIGSIN]

Can you post a list of what you need, i will need the info for

Volume, ware class, min notrioty you want the player to have before they can purchase.

[pelador]

Suggested list: Name references on the end have link and meaning back to my definitions, but understand if they need to remain having EMP naming conventions:

I left the index and 17 id fields identifiable but undefined of course.

Code: Select all

28;0;0;0;0;Index;17id;4;1505;1;1;1;1505;0;0;0;ZA_EMP_CUSTOM_PEL_SPY_DR
28;0;0;0;0;Index;17id;35;6935;1;1;3;6935;1000;0;0;ZA_EMP_CUSTOM_PEL_MLI_DR
28;0;0;0;0;index;17id;35;4119;1;1;3;4119;1000;0;0;ZA_EMP_CUSTOM_PEL_MLO_DR
28;0;0;0;0;index;17id;400;9881;1;1;2;9881;100;0;0;ZA_EMP_CUSTOM_PEL_ADV_DR
28;0;0;0;0;index;17id;200;195938;1;1;2;195938;1000;0;0;ZA_EMP_CUSTOM_PEL_ANY_DR
28;0;0;0;0;index;17id;15;15264;1;1;3;15264;1000;0;0;ZA_EMP_CUSTOM_PEL_EMP_DR
28;0;0;0;0;index;17id;8;2816;1;1;2;2816;100;0;0;ZA_EMP_CUSTOM_PEL_JMP_DR
28;0;0;0;0;index;17id;5;1564;1;1;2;1564;1000;0;0;ZA_EMP_CUSTOM_PEL_BLD_DR
28;0;0;0;0;index;17id;600;25204;1;1;3;25204;1000;0;0;ZA_EMP_CUSTOM_PEL_CTR_DR
28;0;0;0;0;index;17id;50;48896;1;1;2;48896;100;0;0;ZA_EMP_CUSTOM_PEL_HCK_DR
28;0;0;0;0;index;17id;600;43739;1;1;4;43739;1000;0;0;ZA_EMP_CUSTOM_PEL_TRT_DR
28;0;0;0;0;index;17id;40;6084;1;1;2;6084;10000;0;0;ZA_EMP_CUSTOM_PEL_BLZ_DR
28;0;0;0;0;index;17id;28;66788;1;1;2;66788;1000;0;0;ZA_EMP_CUSTOM_PEL_SNP_DR
28;0;0;0;0;index;17id;10;180600;1;1;1;180600;3333;0;0;ZA_EMP_CUSTOM_PEL_ADV_DT
28;0;0;0;0;index;17id;100;6678;1;1;4;6678;0;0;0;ZA_EMP_CUSTOM_PEL_MNG_DR
28;0;0;0;0;index;17id;5;1252;1;1;1;1252;100;0;0;ZA_EMP_CUSTOM_PEL_JAM_DR
28;0;0;0;0;index;17id;5;1434;1;1;2;1434;0;0;0;ZA_EMP_CUSTOM_PEL_ESC_DR

28;0;0;0;0;index;17id;5;1000;1;1;2;1000;0;0;0;ZA_EMP_CUSTOM_PEL_RES_01
28;0;0;0;0;index;17id;5;1000;1;1;2;1000;0;0;0;ZA_EMP_CUSTOM_PEL_RES_02
28;0;0;0;0;index;17id;5;1000;1;1;2;1000;0;0;0;ZA_EMP_CUSTOM_PEL_RES_03

The "DT" on the end of one is not a spelling mistake.

Last 3 are reserved potentials if possible, but can understand if best method is to omit them for now.

[Hieronymos]

Regarding the sniper drone, and its use of a single MD..which would only kill a pilot if in an exposed, unarmored location (like a cockpit or bridge):

perhaps success of sniping kill can be dependant upon both:
Shipclass: like M5,M4,M4,M3,TS,TP--not M6 or larger.
Target hullstrength. Hullstrength implying armor--the only thing that can stop a MD round cold.
Player fightskill. Implying player remotely controls drone nintendo-style.

Thus, experienced player sniping an M5 pilot would be easiest..novice player sniping a pilot in a heavy-hulled M3+, most difficult.

..in any case, Sniperdrone is essentially an early- to mid-game tool. If limited to smaller than M6, really only for early game.

I'm most curious to know if its successful use allows player succes in Assassination missions (assuming player subsequently kills ejected pilot), and Return Ship missions.

[pelador]

V4.3 Upgrade now available:

1) Includes constructor drones to be able to deploy Medium Orbital Weapons Platforms (MOWP) and Large Orbital Weapons platforms (LOWP). The resources are the same as the Small OWP but in the case of an MOWP this is twice the amount required whereas a LOWP is four times the resources.

Also now included a new resource that an SOWP needs and extra 4 construction equipment items of size XL cargo, these are required wether you use a bought drone or a custom fitted drone. They dont have any real significant cost to them but do limited cargo restrictions to XL type. For MOWP and LOWP multiply as above. These have been added as products to the the drones fabs which will automatically recalculate their inclusion in the next cycle.


2) Included a toggle command in the last menu "Universal commands" called Toggle Mine Command which can be used to mark a mine for Inclusion/Exclusion for collection. This can be done individually on a mine or in bulk by mine type. It uses a selection of process and then an individual or seed mine object selection.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Currently testing EMP mod with cargo balancing values. Looking good so far. This will further add balancing charactersitics to the drones that I wanted from outset and EMP mod have been very gracious in offering to adjust values accordingly. Further future details about potential conversion process to follow.

Discussing with DIGSIN how best to handle this and he is being very accomodating to help make the impact as small as possible. Due to new ware value definitions that increase restrictions and the fact that you may have small ships with the drones on them that in future they wont be able to use. It may enforce a simple use of the unistall to remove the ware instances but without having to uninstall the scripts. I will provide detailed information about the changeover when this occurs with the EMP mod. But no need to do anything at this stage now.

[pelador]

Regarding the sniper drone, and its use of a single MD..which would only kill a pilot if in an exposed, unarmored location (like a cockpit or bridge):

perhaps success of sniping kill can be dependant upon both:
Shipclass: like M5,M4,M4,M3,TS,TP--not M6 or larger.
Target hullstrength. Hullstrength implying armor--the only thing that can stop a MD round cold.
Player fightskill. Implying player remotely controls drone nintendo-style.

Thus, experienced player sniping an M5 pilot would be easiest..novice player sniping a pilot in a heavy-hulled M3+, most difficult.

..in any case, Sniperdrone is essentially an early- to mid-game tool. If limited to smaller than M6, really only for early game.

I'm most curious to know if its successful use allows player succes in Assassination missions (assuming player subsequently kills ejected pilot), and Return Ship missions.

Yes I could adjust % base success change per md set (uses between 1 -12 as specified by the player) in order of hull strength ranges off of a seed % this would further help balance settings.

Considering TS and TP are relatively cheap to buy I'm not sure of the value of a sniper drone here. Except for maybe playing styles where buying is restricted due to race foe settings.

TP's potentially have marines on them. And although they may not be pilots it complicates the idea somewhat. Even if standard bail might likley remove them. TS for RP purposes even though they are normally identified as only having the one trader pilot, I sometimes wonder if people think that the TS trader has a co-pilot, such that 2 people may be aboard otherwise its a lonely job, but thats my imagination getting ahead of me. Probably got a suite of entertainment and virtual comms to keep him/her entertained. The restriction to M3 below is however notionally accepted that its a single piloted ship. Even if in modern day RL conventional warfare, fighters are sometimes identified as having 2 occupants. Bails typically seem to be sngle from TS however. Can't remember bail numbers from a TP, not sure if I have attacked one for such a purpose in my own personal games.

The sniper drone is restricted from attacking plot ships (indestructable hulls).

Not sure about the player skill thing, its an automated AI drone. Is possible just don't figure it in vision for the drone, as i obviously can't tie the players hands when in use. Convince me further but I'm not warming to it.

Missions, hmm, I need to test this. In the case of a successfull strike it ejects the pilot and subsequently kills him instantaneously. I should have considered these scenarios. Return mission I think likley not much of a concern due to the ship object being the same and Assasination might just have to continue on to kill the ship to complete the mission or not dependant on value (ship or mission?) which might be the way of registering the kill as its how and where the target is identified (by his/her ship). Be interesting to know in the Vanilla game what happens if you attempt to board an assasination mission ship and not kill it. And although they are different class range of ship as far as the sniper drone is concerned it might have handling in it as a result. But it is something I have overlooked. Hopefully ES have such checks in their MD files but I have no excuses, apologies for this and thanks for pointing it out. Watch this space.

[pelador]

On the general subject of balance:

I appreciate that no two people may like the same degree of difficulty, accesabilty or visionary aspects of developed scripted processes.

As a result in the future I may extend the configuration menu to include a number of user definable parameters within sensible ranges to allow users to self tweak away from suggested defaults for many aspects of the drones qualities.

I'd prefer to finish a comprehensive list of drone ideas first with some focus to the new ship concepts. But having this flexibility would allow users to "flavour" there use as they prefer.

[pelador]

EMP has updated to be compatible with version 2.0. A few new standard technical wares. None of the current wares in use have had any changes as yet, it is as before in version 1.4. So feel free to update this as needs.

EMP is a community resource and therefore is best discussed by all concerned so the move to balancing wares in the drones wont be for a little while yet.

Pelador Drones has done some compatibility testing with Version 2.0 using the beta so i dont expect there to be issues, yet to finalise a complete test myself for reassurance. Its script based apart from the use of EMP so as a result it is very unlikley not to be backward compatible.

I hope to complete reassurance testing tomorrow.

[pelador]

Reassurance testing went without a hitch:

Peladors Drones is Version 2 compatible.

(Remembering of course that you'll need to update the new Version 2 compatible EMP mod)

[pelador]

Got one for ya How bout a communication Drone that allows you to comm stations at a larger distance.

An extension of the comms system based on positioning a drone near a station?

I'm unusre if the comms process is hardcoded into the interface engine as I'm unaware of a scripting function that activates the comms with a station. It might be a signal or a standard script but the absence of a deliberate function to open communications might make it a non-starter using scripting techniques.

I will add it to the list for Brainstorming and look into it for you.

Findings are that unfortunatley the station comms are hardcoded into the interface, so I cant apply scripting techniques to acheve this, sorry dminor would have made a usefull addition.

(Confirmed by acknowledged Scripters in chat)

[pelador]

Deploy Repair Drones

All Drones: [ external image ]


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Overview:

With any ship equipped with:

Special Command Software

and has the following wares:

Freight Drone


Linked Resources:

Teladianium


With this new command in the Engineering and Construction the player can launch a drone or team of drones at a damaged ship or station.

The drones will fill up with repair resource as much as they can then fly to the ship/station and in the case of a ship follow it.
Once within a suitable range they will then commence to use the Teladianium to repair the target.

Teladianium is used at a rate of 1 every 2 seconds and each unit of Teladianium will repair 30 hull points. Its a little different than just a linear operation. As the operation is based on wether the target is stationary and how much the drones have to move in relation to getting to and from their target with supplies of Teladanium but have provided a design spreadsheet to help explain what this means in repairs:

Repair design Process

As stated above drones are required to return to the mothership if and when they run out of Teladianium. Freight Drones have a cargo storage of 800 XL so this means they can accomodate 160 units of Teladianium or 4800 hull points.

When drones complete repairs or run out of energy it will simply return to the mothership. So in the case of large ships the preference of using more drones is advised. Though you can top up supply with a transporter device before it runs out to maintain a smaller team. Any surplus stock of Teladianium is returned when drones come home.

Repair Drones can be recalled.


(Possible Lore/History/flavouring to follow)