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Discussion Topic : X3 Utility CD
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X3 Utility CD - Yes or No ?
I'm happy downloading and wont be interested in a CD
72%
 72%  [ 42 ]
I'm happy downloading but would like a CD
24%
 24%  [ 14 ]
I'm unable to download most things and would like a CD
1%
 1%  [ 1 ]
I cannot download at all and desperately want a CD
1%
 1%  [ 1 ]
Total Votes : 58

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apricotslice





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PostPosted: Thu, 6. Apr 06, 12:22    Post subject: Discussion Topic : X3 Utility CD Reply with quote Print

I've been asked if the X3 Handbook can be released on CD.

Now, although its a big file to download, to put it on a cd, even a mini cd is a big waste of cd space.

But at the back of my poor mad brain, thats in guide overload, is the memory of sometimes reading about people who are unable to download anything bigger than a tiny file due to bad internet connections, expensive bandwidth charges or low bandwidth limits. Particularly the Game Patches and the larger mods.

There are also people who like to have things on disc.

Downloadable things on the X3 site include, X3 Handbook (very soon), Scripts, Mods, Game Patches, Game Demos.

Co-incidently with all the writing I've been doing for the forum recently is bringing 2 books I've written to e-book stage and preparing to cut them onto CD's for sale.

So all sorts of thoughts have been merging themselves in to this :

Why not do an X3 Utility Disk, that contains the Handbook, Game Patches, Game Demos, Script and Mod downloads ? Rough checking indicates this would be about a CD full of X3 stuff.

Obviously, scripts and mods will be updated regularly, and the CD will need to be kept up to date. So versions will probably change regularly.

So I guess the question is : Is anyone interested ?

Another is, Is this acceptable to Egosoft, especially as far as the Game patches are concerned ?

And what issues should be considered in even contemplating this.


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lordsloye





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PostPosted: Thu, 6. Apr 06, 13:05    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

This sounds an interesting and good idea. Personally though I wouldn't use it as I have no problems downloading, despite a bandwidth limit & relatively slow broadband speed.

At risk of stating the obvious (sorry if this just restates what you said!) the CD only makes sense (from a time & money view) either to those who want a CD but can't download/burn their own.

Am looking forward to downloading the handbook, and as you have the material for a CD anyway, if you're happy compiling it then why not?

Quote:
Is anyone interested ? Another is, Is this acceptable to Egosoft, especially as far as the Game patches are concerned ?

And what issues should be considered in even contemplating this.


If you had copyright permissions from contributors (e.g. for mods, scripts + Egosoft) it should be quite easy to do an "on demand" service for the CD though, you'd just have to price postage/CDs and time. You've had people request parts of it already, so go for it!

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Probe





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PostPosted: Thu, 6. Apr 06, 14:17    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

Not appealing in the sense that I have the download bandwidth available.

However, if the CD was compilled with a good menu system that provided both concise information and the ability to apply (or a "how to" guide) scripts etc. I would be very interested.

I think what I'm trying to say is:-

The forum is great and there's an absolute wealth of information contained in it, but it can suffer (by it's open nature) to duplication of info! It can sometimes to be too painful to trawl though reams of posts on a certain subject to and have to filter out contradictions etc! Hence, many newcommers are posting questions that have already been answered because they can't really be botherd to search the archives! It's self perpetuating!!

If your proposed CD could provided an accurate summary on the features it supported it would become a valuable asset to even those of us where downloads are not an issue IMO Smile

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apricotslice





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PostPosted: Thu, 6. Apr 06, 14:42    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

Probe wrote:
The forum is great and there's an absolute wealth of information contained in it, but it can suffer (by it's open nature) to duplication of info! It can sometimes to be too painful to trawl though reams of posts on a certain subject to and have to filter out contradictions etc! Hence, many newcommers are posting questions that have already been answered because they can't really be botherd to search the archives! It's self perpetuating!!


The X3 Handbook should go a long way to achieving this. Although the various guides frequently overlap, acrobat has a search function, so finding all the references for something you want answers for is really easy. Where trawling through all the guides on the forum takes too much time., the handbook will allow you to find each reference in seconds.

Quote:
If your proposed CD could provided an accurate summary on the features it supported it would become a valuable asset to even those of us where downloads are not an issue IMO Smile


Probably the closest one might come to that is using different directories for different things.

\patches
\demos
\mods
\scripts with a whole heap of subdirectories for categories of scripts.

One could do an index I guess, but there is a good deal of work in creating it and maintaining it. I'm not sure that a cd version would or could be much better than is achieved in the community lists now.

Unless one was to do the same thing as the guides and actually compile a full mods and scripts handbook in html, with links to on disc files. Same structure as here, but all on one disc. Something to ponder.


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Chips





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PostPosted: Thu, 6. Apr 06, 15:23    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

I'd imagine that things like handbooks (offical ones) and patches would be an issue, simply because they require proven purchases* to access the files.

As for the rest, just how much (official stuff from Egosoft aside) would each component weigh in at on the download scale? You aren't offering any realistic size values and variables, a complete compilation work of guides etc should (in pdf form) weigh in at a potential few Mb only? Is it more? Information upon what they will receive etc.

The bulk sizes would be sheer volumes of things, as in tons of mods/scripts etc. But is it necessary to pack them all in, when people could simply choose what they want and download files that are under a few kb each?

Tis a nice idea all in, but a little concerned that you're asking people to vote upon something that doesn't actually contain any helpful information as to just how big their download will be/could be, or anything else. You also mention nothing as to pricing of it as well.

Polls should be on an informed basis - but this lacks much information.




*unless this has been changed within the past 4 months


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Cycrow
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PostPosted: Thu, 6. Apr 06, 15:27    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

Probe wrote:
However, if the CD was compilled with a good menu system that provided both concise information and the ability to apply (or a "how to" guide) scripts etc. I would be very interested.


the ability to apply scripts is easy, just use the script manager Wink


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apricotslice





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PostPosted: Thu, 6. Apr 06, 16:13    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

Chips wrote:
I'd imagine that things like handbooks (offical ones) and patches would be an issue, simply because they require proven purchases* to access the files.


The only official ones are the redone manual, and the scripting manual, both of which require registration to download. So neither are useable for this purpose.

The patches I beleive were declassified, although I'd have to check that.

Quote:

As for the rest, just how much (official stuff from Egosoft aside) would each component weigh in at on the download scale? You aren't offering any realistic size values and variables, a complete compilation work of guides etc should (in pdf form) weigh in at a potential few Mb only? Is it more? Information upon what they will receive etc.


A while ago I started downloading scripts and mods I didnt intend to use immediately, as I had a few where when I decided I did want to use them, I had a lot of trouble finding them again. Since then, I have accumulated the vast majority of the patches, scripts and mods, in all forms of release. Those I've missed is probably only a few dozen, and they are ones where the links dont work, or they are not on the official lists and I missed their announcment threads or havent yet seen the sig adverts.

Not counting demos and advertising files, the directory holds the following :

192 files combining to 563mb.

Of which the new handbook is only 5mb extra.

Quote:
Tis a nice idea all in, but a little concerned that you're asking people to vote upon something that doesn't actually contain any helpful information as to just how big their download will be/could be, or anything else. You also mention nothing as to pricing of it as well.


Not sure what your saying here. Sure, any single download may not amount to much, but cumulatory over time ? Mine downloading is certainly significant. (my choice to of course.)

Re pricing, I have no idea. I havent even attempted to cost it. But if the cost comes out at more than US$10/E10/P10, it wouldnt interest many at all I would think. Bulk of that would be snail mail.

Quote:

Polls should be on an informed basis - but this lacks much information.


Thats what the thread is for, to determine the information needed. Smile

You seem to be assuming I had a fixed end point in mind and just want to sell it. I have a half baked idea that needs mixing and putting in the oven to see what comes out !


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Probe





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PostPosted: Thu, 6. Apr 06, 16:20    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

Cycrow wrote:
Probe wrote:
However, if the CD was compilled with a good menu system that provided both concise information and the ability to apply (or a "how to" guide) scripts etc. I would be very interested.


the ability to apply scripts is easy, just use the script manager Wink


Oh, well if you want to get picky.... Laughing

I guess some of us (me) are guilty of not researching our case before presenting it Shocked Thanks for bringing it to my attention!

Leamington eh, Cycrow? I was born there..... some time ago Wink
Lived at Kineton for a few years.

I know... "off topic" Exclamation

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Cycrow
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PostPosted: Thu, 6. Apr 06, 16:42    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

well, i made the script manage so it makes installing scripts and mods a very easy process Smile

i live around lillington area, was born here, but will prolly move away once i find a job Smile


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mrbadger





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PostPosted: Thu, 6. Apr 06, 19:26    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

would not a bittorrent be a better idea?


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Cycrow
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PostPosted: Thu, 6. Apr 06, 20:25    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

well, the whole idea would be for people who cant download, bittorrent is jsut another method to download so it wouldn't help.


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Paajtor





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PostPosted: Thu, 6. Apr 06, 20:33    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

This would be a great idea for a buddy of mine.
The guy lives in rural N-Zealand, with a crappy dialup.
He's still playing on 1.2.01, and hasn't updated to 1.4 because of the big download.
It's the summer-season in NZ, and he's usually busy hunting and hiking, but when the winter gets near, I'm sure he'll return to X3, and would be happy to order the most important files and updates on cdrom. Smile

I've thought of burning the stuff on cdr for him, but I don't think it will work...most of my attempts to burn anything on cdr fail, because I have a few StarForce-games on my machine.... Rolling Eyes (being X3 and SilentHunterIII).

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apricotslice





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PostPosted: Fri, 7. Apr 06, 02:04    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

Paajtor wrote:
This would be a great idea for a buddy of mine.
The guy lives in rural N-Zealand, with a crappy dialup.
He's still playing on 1.2.01, and hasn't updated to 1.4 because of the big download.......


Ask him Smile

The last paragraph issue you mention isnt affecting me. But that one should not be mentioned again, as it will get the thread locked if it is.


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soleseacher





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PostPosted: Fri, 7. Apr 06, 05:10    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

Well if were on the margins of CD's just look at the size of the 1.4 patch.
To some poor sole on narrow band thats a nightmere, and thats if they got an internet connection or permission to use it from the pears.
nevermind Scripes and mods Egosoft should foot the cost for these updates for what inicially is there mistakes on the master in the first place.
Or well not them but the publishers as they forced the issue.
No bloody wonder X3 is going for a fiver on E-Bay Laughing Laughing

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Chips





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PostPosted: Mon, 10. Apr 06, 12:53    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

apricotslice wrote:
Chips wrote:

Tis a nice idea all in, but a little concerned that you're asking people to vote upon something that doesn't actually contain any helpful information as to just how big their download will be/could be, or anything else. You also mention nothing as to pricing of it as well.


Not sure what your saying here. Sure, any single download may not amount to much, but cumulatory over time ? Mine downloading is certainly significant. (my choice to of course.)

The implication was simply:

Vote whether you'd rather have a cd or download.

How can someone vote on whether they would prefer to download or get a cd unless they know the download size - that was my whole point (as well as to general costing simply because someone may say "well, $10 is worthwhile because it will take 48 hrs to download on dial up", or they may say "i'll wait the 24 hour download to save cash I don't have" - whereas others may say "it'll take 5 mins" - but ONLY if they know the size/price.

Without that I don't see how people can say they'd prefer a cd over download or vica versa - that is all. Due to this, I'd be worried that the poll result may not actually reflect take up of your offer for cd's - or lead to a much larger download usage than anticipated if you are hosting on a bandwidth monitored web location. You may spend ages creating menus etc on a cd/dvd - only to find that the 12 hours design yields perhaps 20 cds wanted.


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