[X3LU] Mayhem 3.21b

[Joubarbe]

Access denied.

[temetvince]

Last try with google drive. https://drive.google.com/file/d/1RhEi7W ... sp=sharing

[Joubarbe]

All good, thanks for the report. Ship costs actually ignore the quality set, so it's always based on Normal quality. If you are used to pay garbage, you got scammed, but if you prefer very high quality, you always had a good deal
Will be fixed in 3.8.
(the menu shows the good price though)

[hephasttus]

I am totally loving the mod and the continued updates/support, thank you so much for keeping this game alive.

I can't play X4 due to the god awful optimization and clunk, such a disappointment but the game has so much potential.

[Joubarbe]

3.8 Missiles Overhaul

Missiles have gone through a complete overhaul. The main idea is to reduce the confusion that exists between all the different types of missiles, and also to modify the vanilla gameplay by sticking a bit more to a believable model.

The first major change concerns the classification of missiles. You have three categories:

• Fox 1: Semi active radar homing. These missiles are not heatseeker and require a locked target to be fired. They are rather slow and have a medium range. Fox 1 missiles can only be identified by CCDS MK1. The identification process can be done at high range and is mandatory for a chaff to be fired at the incoming missile.
• Fox 2: Infrared. These missiles are heatseeker (they can lock a missile instead of a ship) and do not require a lock. They are fast and have a short range. Fox 2 missiles can only be identified by CCDS MK2, at medium range.
• Fox 3: Active radar homing. These missiles are not heatseeker and do not require a lock. They have an optimal speed and a high range. Fox 3 missiles can only be identified by CCDS MK3, at short range.
• Artillery missiles: Unguided, aka Dumbfire. These missiles can only be fired by M7M. They have the highest speed, the highest range, the highest damage and the highest price. Considering their wild nature, it is not possible to intercept artillery missiles with CCDS and chaffs. Like all other missiles however, they can be destroyed by laser fires, even though all missiles are a lot more resistant than in vanilla.

All missiles are racialized and every race has one of each type of missile.

The AI has been improved to fire missiles in the most efficient way possible, and also to keep good game performance and balanced gameplay. Therefore, the AI does not use missiles when out of sector. The AI will also fire a missile only if the target has low shields, or none at all. Finally, the AI uses M8, but it doesn't use M7M. Each M8 has all CCDS built-in and can protect nearby allies.

Fighters cannot fire missiles. The only ship classes that can are M1, M2, M6, M7, M7M and M8. Artillery missiles can only be fired by M7M, while Fox missiles can be fired by all other classes.

There is no hotkey to manually fire a chaff. That's because CCDS have an extremely low chance of missing, and that you, as a human, cannot beat a radar.

All missiles come with new descriptions / lore, and a reduced set of 4 icons:



Here you have Fox 1, 2, 3, and Artillery, for Argons and Borons.
Laser icons will also be re-colorized to reflect their racial main ownership.

For other incoming changes, see 3.8 changelog.

[hephasttus]

Awesome update man for 3.8, good work !

1. In regard to the missile changes and locking mechanism, is the AI able to efficiently use these missiles that require a lock? EG actually facing their targets long enough to fire these new missile types?

2. For the population change during production (which I like btw) is the +1 population per turret, is this in regards to each turret side or per gun on each turret?

Turret (4) left = +4 more pops or +1 more pop?

3. With the capital ship firing rate being doubled, will this also increase the power drain for lasers?

Just some feedback, I would vote to add transporter equipment to ships base loadouts, I feel it just makes the game perform smoother, especially in regards to assisting AI carriers functionally. (Honestly I would just be happy if AI carriers had them)

It also encourages players to partake in combat personally without having to worry about being blown up and getting "game over."

I like the change in regards to capital weaponry, this should make them feel more powerful especially against swarms of smaller ships, which have always been their weakness.
I wonder if maybe increasing the hull points a bit would be beneficial, to increase the M7/1/2 vs M7/1/2 battles due to the increased firepower? I just wonder if their duels will be too short. But it would further increase their power gap between the smaller ships as a side-effect which may be too much right now.

But do whatever you feel is healthy for the mod I love your work.


"You can now send your ship to recycle in one click from the maintenance screen"

Thank you

[Joubarbe]

1. No the locking doesn’t change anything for the AI. I could add an artificial waiting though, of 2 or 3 seconds before firing the missile.

2. If you have a ship with one turret at the back, you need 2 people. 1 pilot + 1 turret guy. Guns are disregarded, we assume that like the player, the AI can manage everything.

3. Yes it will. I don't energy is a problem for capital ships though. Is it?

All AI Carriers already have a Transporter Device by default and I won’t add it to player ships.

The maintenance thing can also rebuild some of your ships for you after recycling!

Thanks.

[hephasttus]

1. No the locking doesn’t change anything for the AI. I could add an artificial waiting though, of 2 or 3 seconds before firing the missile.

2. If you have a ship with one turret at the back, you need 2 people. 1 pilot + 1 turret guy. Guns are disregarded, we assume that like the player, the AI can manage everything.

3. Yes it will. I don't energy is a problem for capital ships though. Is it?

All AI Carriers already have a Transporter Device by default and I won’t add it to player ships.

The maintenance thing can also rebuild some of your ships for you after recycling!

Thanks.

1. No thats probably fine the way you have it, I was just curious if the AI retardo-maneuvering would be too complicated to maintain a lock.

2. Dope. Although might have weird balancing, because of some M3's with turrets vs m6's that only have a couple turrets would have the same pop cost.

3. I'm not sure.. I'll have to test, I just assumed they would have issues if their energy use is being effectively doubled, at least for the AI. But I will have to test that when I get back to my computer in a few days.

Transported device on AI carriers are enough for me.

[Betelgeuse97]

With no more boarding, how will we get capital ships in 3.8+ in the early game? Or will it be back to the old-old way where the only way is through research?

[alexalsp]

With no more boarding, how will we get capital ships in 3.8+ in the early game? Or will it be back to the old-old way where the only way is through research?

Earlier the author mentioned hacking, perhaps this will be a replacement for boarding.

[aurelcourt]

With no more boarding, how will we get capital ships in 3.8+ in the early game? Or will it be back to the old-old way where the only way is through research?

Buying from factions with reputation too!
M7 come at 12 loyalty I believe, not too hard to reach

[dunderhead327]

3.8 Missiles Overhaul

The first major change concerns the classification of missiles. You have three categories:

• Fox 1: Semi active radar homing. These missiles are not heatseeker and require a locked target to be fired. They are rather slow and have a medium range. Fox 1 missiles can only be identified by CCDS MK1. The identification process can be done at high range and is mandatory for a chaff to be fired at the incoming missile.
• Fox 2: Infrared. These missiles are heatseeker (they can lock a missile instead of a ship) and do not require a lock. They are fast and have a short range. Fox 2 missiles can only be identified by CCDS MK2, at medium range.
• Fox 3: Active radar homing. These missiles are not heatseeker and do not require a lock. They have an optimal speed and a high range. Fox 3 missiles can only be identified by CCDS MK3, at short range.
• Artillery missiles: Unguided, aka Dumbfire. These missiles can only be fired by M7M. They have the highest speed, the highest range, the highest damage and the highest price. Considering their wild nature, it is not possible to intercept artillery missiles with CCDS and chaffs. Like all other missiles however, they can be destroyed by laser fires, even though all missiles are a lot more resistant than in vanilla.

Sounds good, but I would suggest that your intercept logic could be improved:

Assuming you are keeping the same pricing structure for CCDS i.e. CCDS Mk1 is cheapest because it's the simplest:

• Fox 3 missiles are active EM emitters, so should be the easiest to detect. The CCDS does not need to have a radar emitter as it will target the missile's own emissions. Therefore, CCDS Mk1 would take Fox 3s.
• Dumbfire missiles fly straight and level, and are not EM emitters. The CCDS system needs to be more complex, as it has to be an active system. CCDS Mk2 targets these.
• Fox 1 and Fox 2 missiles are both passive seekers, the difference being the wavelength of the radiation they target. The reflected radiation from the launch platform's targeting radar (or laser designator, or whatever) effectively turns the target into an EM emitter for Fox 2s. Because the missiles are passive homing, an active CCDS system is required, but it needs to be able to predict the missile's potential manoeuvres. This is the CCDS Mk3.

[erone01234]

Yeah that’s probably the end of the whole marine system.

marins il miss you

[Joubarbe]

I'm well aware of the inaccuracy of my system. However:

1/ You'll never manage to reproduce the real systems in X3. The whole SARH / IR/ ARH / blah blah is useless.
2/ This is a video game, it must be intelligible. Therefore 1, 2, 3 catched by 1, 2, 3 is way easier to understand. The higher number is better.
3/ The important thing about this system is to have one CCDS per missile type.

[dunderhead327]

I'm well aware of the inaccuracy of my system. However:

1/ You'll never manage to reproduce the real systems in X3. The whole SARH / IR/ ARH / blah blah is useless.
2/ This is a video game, it must be intelligible. Therefore 1, 2, 3 catched by 1, 2, 3 is way easier to understand. The higher number is better.
3/ The important thing about this system is to have one CCDS per missile type.

Fair enough. As long as you've thought about it, it's all good.

[Betelgeuse97]

With no more boarding, how will we get capital ships in 3.8+ in the early game? Or will it be back to the old-old way where the only way is through research?

Buying from factions with reputation too!
M7 come at 12 loyalty I believe, not too hard to reach

Oh yeah I forgot about that. Unfortunately it takes a very long time to build those ships.

EDIT: In place of a boarding system, I was thinking of something like so to give rewards for destroying ships similar to Stellaris's debris mechanics, especially useful for early game:

Upon destroying ships (any class), there is a chance to drop debris. A container is enough (option 1), but if the game allows then a ship debris can spawn instead (option 2). Both the player and NPC factions can take part in the event.
- If the container option were to be implemented, then the container contains debris equal to a fraction of the maximum research value of the destroyed ship (let's say 20%). it's as simple as picking up the container, dropping it off at the research station, and then select that container for research. Upon successful research of that container (all containers cost the same amount of research time regardless), the container is identified. At this point, the player can either convert it to research points for storage (see below) for future research of that particular ship or sell the identified container to factions (if rep is high enough, say +7) for money. To sell the container, there can be an option to put the container for sale so that NPC traders can buy it.
- If the ship debris option were to be implemented, then an M5 could fly near the ship debris and scan it using a data scanner (this makes data scanner more useful for other player-controlled ships instead of restricting it to the player's current ship). A fraction (let's say 20%) of the research value of the ship is then stored for researching that particular ship. If the player's reputation is high enough with a faction, the player can opt to sell the research points to factions for money instead of uploading the research points to the research station(s).

Example for case 1: Your only research station researches at a normal rate of 10 points/cycle. A ship requires 500 research points in total to get the blueprint. This ship is destroyed during a battle and it generates a container. Your M5 collects this container (option 1) and drops it off at your research station. Your research station (and only the station that has the container can research that container) researches it and finishes the research, giving 100 research points for storage. To put the container up for sale, the player puts it up for sale under the "logistics" tab.

Example for case 2, using the same research station and ship example: The destroyed ship turns into ship debris (option 2) upon destruction. Your M5 scans this debris, giving 100 research points. The player has a choice to put it in storage or sell the 100 research points for money.

In both cases where the player chooses to keep the points, your research station can then select the ship you salvaged for research; rather than giving 100 points right away, it will double the research rate from 10 points/cycle to 20 points/cycle while consuming 10 points per cycle from the pool of 100 points until the 100 points run out. In other words, it'll take 10 cycles for that station to get rid of the 100 points before returning to 10 points/cycle.

If the player sells research points, that faction can build that ship if enough points are sold/acquired. (This could be expanded into a research market so that factions could sell research to the player at +8 rep or higher; naturally the research points would cost more than buying their ship.)

[Joubarbe]

Good ideas again. The galaxy generator generates debris in the galaxy. I actually wanted to do something with that. One day They would be good for a quick boost early game, but I don't think it's a good idea to keep on with that. Debris would be all over the place, and the engine doesn't like them.

[Betelgeuse97]

Good ideas again. The galaxy generator generates debris in the galaxy. I actually wanted to do something with that. One day They would be good for a quick boost early game, but I don't think it's a good idea to keep on with that. Debris would be all over the place, and the engine doesn't like them.

Sorry, the rock debris is not to be confused with ship debris. They are two different things.

Ship debris refers to the shipwrecks seen in the vanilla games, although there don't seem to be many to represent all the ships in the game.

[Joubarbe]

Oh yeah, sorry, misread.

[aurelcourt]

Buying from factions with reputation too!
M7 come at 12 loyalty I believe, not too hard to reach

Oh yeah I forgot about that. Unfortunately it takes a very long time to build those ships.

Just bought a M7 Griffon from Argons, it was built a couple of minutes later, really not long at all

Maybe you tried at a time when there was a long queue...?