[EMP]Extended Mod Pack (2.7 compatible) [Not needed for latest Plugin Manager]

The place to discuss scripting and game modifications for X³: Terran Conflict and X³: Albion Prelude.

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pelador
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Post by pelador » Sun, 5. Apr 09, 14:16

X2-Eliah wrote:I am speaking from a basic end-user viewpoint, so if I am speaking nonsense, feel free to ignore this. But maybe it will help anyway.

One problem I see with the EMP mod is that it cannot be installed purely as a fake patch - there are several other mods out there (and more likely will be) that tend to use the same mod enabling thing that is used for this one.. Having the EMP thus allows for some scripts (pelador's drones, for example) while denying the use of some mods..
If you want to use EMP with other mods feel free to contact me, I can help you with the current aspects of merging TwareT content, might get a bit technical and require some of the various editing tools though. Though might be best waiting to make those choices after this debate, as merging mods requires some self-editing for version control.

I imagine DIGSIN might want to offer guidance for merging with independant mods where these issues occur. I suppose its then a question of wether they are EMP freindly, I'm not a confident modder so dont want to come over the "expert" on finding best solutions to merged content. But I understand the use of the Twares types files however, well enough for custom work anyhow, I hope. :wink:

Modders will also understand the implications of merging content and will consider the issues that are being discussed here, so it's just as good to discuss with the development in question also. Its not my place to dictate or impose how people develop S&M solutions but EMP is designed with a community focus in mind to help avoid the above issues. So with the improvements DIGSIN is suggesting it makes it more attractive for others, especially scripters to use EMP for wares they wish to include (at least on the smaller scale) or design mods with EMP in mind.

Thats my point of view, other modders especially large scale developments will understandably want to remain seperate, having their own managed process, but will consider EMP, currently I know of one main development in mind that will have the strategy to be considerate of EMP including its content. But I cant state for all. Examples of other script work have made themselves EMP freindly also but remain independant. So there is more than one solution to the issues of utilising game content.

DIGSIN
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Post by DIGSIN » Sat, 11. Apr 09, 17:34

X2-Eliah wrote:I am speaking from a basic end-user viewpoint, so if I am speaking nonsense, feel free to ignore this. But maybe it will help anyway.

One problem I see with the EMP mod is that it cannot be installed purely as a fake patch - there are several other mods out there (and more likely will be) that tend to use the same mod enabling thing that is used for this one.. Having the EMP thus allows for some scripts (pelador's drones, for example) while denying the use of some mods..
Not necessarily X2-Eliah, all the end user needs to do is change the name of the mod to the last number of cat/dat

EG
We are up to number 07 cat/dat, all the end user needs to do is name the mod they wat as 08 cat/dat and then name the EMP mod as 09 cat/dat, this will make the game load up all the cats.dats and overwrite any files with the latest version.

So if a mod already contains a TWare file and is set as 08 when the game loads up 09 cat/dat (EMP) it will overwrite the TWare file with the EMP version.
The only downfall is if the mod requires a certain slot, hence the reason for having xx amount of free slots for the mods to use.

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ScRaT_GER
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Post by ScRaT_GER » Fri, 17. Apr 09, 09:35

Hi,

at the moment I am trying to get my script 'Teladi Information Service' to use an EMP-Ware Slot.

There are two things, that just won't work:

1.

My setup script looks like this:

001 load text: id=8300
...
011 $station.array = get station array: of race Teladi class/type=Handelsstation
012 $size.station.array = size of array $station.array
013 while $size.station.array
014 |dec $size.station.array =
015 |$station = $station.array[$size.station.array]
016 |$station -> add product to factory or dock: ZA_EMP_BLANK_WARE_CUSTOM11_2
017 |= $station -> add 1 units of ZA_EMP_BLANK_WARE_CUSTOM11_2
...
020 end


The loaded t-file '8300':

<page id="17">
 <t id="10353">{9,519}eladi {9,508}nformation {9,518}ervice</t>
 <t id="10354">...</t>
</page>


As you see, the product will be added to every Teladi Trade Station.

In t-file '8300' ZA_EMP_BLANK_WARE_CUSTOM11_2 is defined as 'Teladi Information Service'.
So, if I understand it correctly, a ware named 'Teladi Information Service' should be added to all Teladi trade stations.

However this is not happening. In the trade stations I can buy a ware, called 'ZA_EMP_BLANK_WARE_CUSTOM11_2' and only after I first started my script, the ware will rename to 'Teladi Information Service'.
The ware's description is always correctly displayed.

I hope this explanation is understandable and that someone knows the mistake.

EDIT:

I contiued observing the issue and now, while the ware is correctly displayed in the ships cargobay, it is still called 'ZA_EMP_BLANK_WARE_CUSTOM11_2' in the stations cargo bay.
How can that be?

2.

I would like this ware, to be a ship extension, not a trading good.
How can I do this?

Greets,
ScRaT

DIGSIN
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Post by DIGSIN » Fri, 17. Apr 09, 21:24

Do you have language tags in?

EG
<language id="44"> (44 for English)

<page id="17">
<t id="10353">{9,519}eladi {9,508}nformation {9,518}ervice</t>
<t id="10354">...</t>
</page>

</language>

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ScRaT_GER
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Post by ScRaT_GER » Sat, 18. Apr 09, 16:15

Yes I have.

But I think I know why the ware is not named correctly.
The setup script seems to fail in loading the t-file, although it says

load text: id=8300

in line #1.

But not completely, as the ware is 'sometimes' displayed correcty.

Here are some screens. The first showing the wares in a teladi trade station - at the bottom you see 'Teladi Informations Service', which is correct. This screenshot was made, while flying in the universe, directly after loading a savegame.

Image

The next one was taken after I docked at the station and opened the trade menu. I think you see what happened.

Image

If I, after that, seperately load the t-file (8300) the names are displayed corectly again.

Anyone knows how that can happen?

Greets,
ScRaT

EDIT:

I contiued observing the problem.

The ware, after it has been named correctly, always is renamed to
'ZA_EMP_BLANK_WARE_CUSTOM11_2' after docking at any station.

If I seperately load the t-file (8300), while I'm docked, and then dock off, the ware name is not changed to 'ZA_EMP_BLANK_WARE_CUSTOM11_2'.
So it only affects the docking.

I'm really helpless. Could it be a script? For testing purposes I have only installed my 'Teladi Information Service'- and my 'Trade Overview'-Script, but none could have such an effect.

Or could it be a hardware problem? To little RAM (4GB) for the t-files^^?

Greets,
ScRaT

pelador
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Post by pelador » Sat, 18. Apr 09, 16:47

Yes it seems to be a seperate condition that goes against convention. I had the same problem when using EMP wares for DAD drones.

Even though the EMP details are loaded using an init script before the set-up scripts so you can override the names in most usage. It seems docking is an oddity. The names get changed to protect the innocent and it appears that the t-files are reloaded in text file number order in this situation.

The easiest solution at present is to use a t-file with a number larger than EMP. I had previously reported it in PM's and I beleive it was being looked into.

It does raise the question though if a solution cant be found if wether it would be sensible to lower EMPs text file number to accomodate a greater range (if not all) in custom text file useage.

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ScRaT_GER
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Post by ScRaT_GER » Sat, 18. Apr 09, 17:24

Thanks!
At least I'm not the only one!

If this problem is known, why wasn't this solved earlier?
The t-files range from #1000 to #9999. Why does the mod use #8899?
Why not #1001?

So, DIGSIN or whoever is responsible for this mod, could you please lower the t-file number?
It wouldn't be much work at all (changing about 2 entries?), but would, imho, make this mod more scripter friendly.

Greets,
ScRaT

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ScRaT_GER
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Post by ScRaT_GER » Sun, 26. Apr 09, 11:50

Well, since there was no reaction I just changed the t-file from my script to a higher one. So now the problem with docking is solved, but what about the other question I had:
I would like this ware, to be a ship extension, not a trading good.
How can I do this?
Anyone can answer this?

Greets,
ScRaT

pelador
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Post by pelador » Sun, 26. Apr 09, 13:11

ScRaT_GER wrote:Well, since there was no reaction I just changed the t-file from my script to a higher one. So now the problem with docking is solved, but what about the other question I had:
I would like this ware, to be a ship extension, not a trading good.
How can I do this?
Anyone can answer this?

Greets,
ScRaT
I'm not sure you can ScRaT. There is no specific field entry or cargo permutations in the TwareT definitions that allow for the setting of wether an item is treated as equipment. There must be settings elsewhere or ES has some algorythm that is used to determine these.

I'd also really like to know where and/or how these qualities are applied.

pelador
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Post by pelador » Thu, 7. May 09, 11:04

DIGSIN any news of the flexibility of TwareT definitions in EMP mod.

Its been over a month since the original question was raised and DAD has been patiently waiting for the decision.

I'd prefer to use a community solution that allows scripters full flexibility of use if possible.

fud
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Post by fud » Sat, 16. May 09, 01:40

I'm wondering on a 2.0 update too.

I can't seem to make any changes in it.

Add to that, LV's Imperial Labs script, dropping 4-5 readtext items around, and cycrow's SCS not showing up anywhere...


Bah!

I can't make heads/tails of that file.

BlackRain
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Post by BlackRain » Sat, 23. May 09, 05:51

Can we use this with 2.0 or no?

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LV
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Post by LV » Sat, 23. May 09, 09:23

well i'm using it with 2.0

i've been testing the lower named t file for the last few days as i renamed it from 8899 to 999 and it seems fine, as far as the other issues pelador until digsin retuns i have no idea

i'll change the links so it uses 999 as soon as digsin re-appears

DIGSIN
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Post by DIGSIN » Tue, 26. May 09, 23:02

Sorry Guys i have been busy with that annoying thing called 'real life'

I have resumed the work on the EMP2 again, unfortunalty this will mean a couple of weeks before i can even think of putting it for download, just need to complete tweaking the prices and notoriety settings.

@Blackrain, the download in the OP will be ok for patch 2, this latest version is just an extension to the original EMP

thunderai
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Post by thunderai » Sat, 30. May 09, 09:08

Maybe this has been covered before, but I have the latest version and the Jumpkits script/mod has the blank default name. Is this a problem with the jumpkits script or my install of this mod?

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