Russia-Ukraine War

[Observe]

Has anyone else noticed that Russia is saying very little to nothing about those gas pipelines being sabotaged, they have gone from threatening the world with nuclear annihilation for attacking their sovereignty, to ignoring their multi-billion dollar pipeline being attacked, when normally they would be screaming and shouting about it accusing everyone from the US, NATO and Ukraine of a terrorist attack, but now nothing, I wonder why.

If Russia blew up their own pipeline, it could be they did it as a diversion while they are annexing parts of Ukraine. Get the world distracted. I'm guessing there is more to come from whoever did it.

[felter]

Has anyone else noticed that Russia is saying very little to nothing about those gas pipelines being sabotaged, they have gone from threatening the world with nuclear annihilation for attacking their sovereignty, to ignoring their multi-billion dollar pipeline being attacked, when normally they would be screaming and shouting about it accusing everyone from the US, NATO and Ukraine of a terrorist attack, but now nothing, I wonder why.

Meanwhile Western press prints and airs the most hair raising conspirancy theories why no one else but Russia profits from blowing up its own property and losing its economical and political leverage on EU. The question who else could profit from the destruction of the pipelines hardly rises above sealevel.
The only positive thing I see is that the US and EU gouvernments are confident that no evidence will ever be traced back to them. It's not like we will see the truth in the forseeable future; Assange has been silenced.

I'm not saying they did, just that they are not saying basically anything about it, which is pretty much well out of character for Russia, while wondering why. But saying that, with you saying what you said, I take it you actually think they did, or at least your subconscious does.

[Cpt.Jericho]

If you mean by that I'm thinking that the USA orchestrated this act of terror on European energy infrastructure as a reminder who owns NATO states asses, then you are correct. No other country profits as much as the USA from this. Political and economical.

However, I severely hope I'm wrong. The consequences if I'm not are far more severe than anything we have seen so far.

[felter]

If you mean by that I'm thinking that the USA orchestrated this act of terror on European energy infrastructure as a reminder who owns NATO states asses, then you are correct. No other country profits as much as the USA from this. Political and economical.

However, I severely hope I'm wrong. The consequences if I'm not are far more severe than anything we have seen so far.

To do it, you would have to have the resources and the means to do it, while America does have those resources and means to do it, they have not been seen in the vicinity by the countries monitoring those waters, mainly Sweden, Finland and Denmark meanwhile just last week there were several Russian navy ships and at least one Russian submarine recorded in the exact area of the sabotage. Once again, not saying it was the Russians, it could just be pure coincidence as they are known to hang out in these areas to test out the defences of the monitoring countries, you know sabre-rattling. That being said, do you know that Russia has a submarine that's sole purpose is underwater sabotage, as far as I can tell while America has plenty of submarines, they don't actually have one dedicated solely to underwater sabotage, just saying.

[Falcrack]

If you mean by that I'm thinking that the USA orchestrated this act of terror on European energy infrastructure as a reminder who owns NATO states asses, then you are correct. No other country profits as much as the USA from this. Political and economical.

However, I severely hope I'm wrong. The consequences if I'm not are far more severe than anything we have seen so far.

I think the argument about why the US would not do it are contained in your post. The US would suffer enormous political damage if it was proved that they did this. Far more damage than they could hope to gain by the act of sabotage. It is too much of a risk for too little gain. Besides being unethical. From what I have seen of Joe Biden, whether you agree with his policies or not, I feel that he is a genuinely ethical person.

These are the actions of someone who wants to divide the Europeans and the US. And some people just eat up this conspiracy theory minus any proof whatsoever because it fits with what they want to believe.

[fiksal]

Short term and knee jerk reactions are well within Russia's capabilities.
You do recall this is the country that started the war with Ukraine, right? Before that it was the less crazy country that destroyed cheese and tomatoes with bulldozer just to show the West who is the boss. - do you remember that one?


There's probably somewhere a Russian general smilling at his brilliant idea while others are still wondering - what the hell was that for?


ambigious show of power is what it might be.

[chew-ie]

.. cheese got annihilated ..

That's just. ... evil

[mr.WHO]

US announced that they will merge and centrally coourdinate all NATO training programs of Ukraine forces - apperently till now each NATO country was doing it on it's own.


According to Russian sources, Ukraine encircled Russian forces in Lyman. This is first encirlmement of Russian forces, but not first encirlement of this war - there was Mariupol and Chernichiv (encicrled, but sucessfully fought and the encirlement has been lifted).




Edit:

Only Hungary and Turkey left in Finland and Sweden NATO ratification process.

[Chips]

Apparently Russia can't repair the pipelines unless sanctions are lifted...

As for who profits most, apparently some here think the USA. But lets look at a few perspectives.

Why is Russia annexing regions? Why is it making threats about nukes or all out war if attacking Russia, and claiming land that's an active warzone is Russian? Blackmail, scaremongering and bargaining. The annexation is a clear hope it intimidates and frightens Ukraine or its allies, that escalation and nukes will occur. It bolsters the people back home's opinion (now it's Russia being attacked... not some special military operation, but save the motherland). Imagine a ceasefire happens. Russia wants sanctions lifted, it's bitched and whined about them from the start.

Europe has complained and whined about the gas.

Now the two are linked. They can't now supply gas (in the fantasy world things turn to a state of north/south korea-esque indefinite war/peace scenario or even if not) without sanctions being lifted. There's nothing more to do... and winter is coming, and the public of Germany and other nations may "freeze" with power outages, business not working and so on (that's a lot of public pressure to not be involved in war/sanctions).

Russia has nothing to gain? Uh huh. Seems more plausible than the USA did it to... *vague hand waving* reasons.

As for the annexation - they don't even control large areas of 2 of the regions they're claiming. Blimey.

[fiksal]

.. cheese got annihilated ..

That's just. ... evil

oh yeah, Russia can't have western cheese, it's probably full of anti ethnic Russian viruses...
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co ... 818186.amp

or am I confusing it with Ukrainian birds.... anyways, the cheese and tomato problem was solved.

The birds flew away though.

[JSDD]

As for who profits most, apparently some here think the USA. But lets look at a few perspectives.

US fracking gas is in competition with cheap russian pipeline gas ...
// maybe "competition" is the wrong word here ... russian gas is 8x cheaper

the US attacked japan in the 19th century ... you know why?
=> their borders were closed for foreigners, including their companies ...that war was "US economic policy"

... as it is right now, and has been for the last couple of years ... what "interest" could the US have in the energy policy of a foreign continent ?
// dont make me laugh with that "energy security" argument ...
// in the eyes of the US, everything is about "security" ... national security means spying on merkels phone calls, even if merkel wasnt in US territory

and if it wasnt the US, then it was poland, they just finished themselves building a new pipeline to the north (some wiking country, dunno which .. )

[Sovereign01]

From looking at the map, there's literally no country surrounding Ukraine that fallout can land on without repercussions against Russia- north and east is Belarus/Russia, south is Crimea then over the black sea NATO, west is more NATO.

[JSDD]

N ... aive
A ... american
T ... ool to
O ... verreach into other countries

[Cpt.Jericho]

US fracking gas is in competition with cheap russian pipeline gas ...
// maybe "competition" is the wrong word here ... russian gas is 8x cheaper

Not to forget that by the destruction of the pipelines said expensive fracking gas (no matter where it was mined) is now the only option for Europe. Swinging the dependency from East to West doesn't make countries less dependant but easier to control.

[mr.WHO]

You anti-US delusions fail to notice that all the recent gas deals to compensate in Europe are from Norway, North Africa and Middle East.

American fracking in majority for American market, plus Europe has it's own fracking reserves if things would get desperate in long term.

[Falcrack]

N ... aive
A ... american
T ... ool to
O ... verreach into other countries

You should move to Russia. I think you would be a lot happier there.

As to "overreaching into other countries", I would think that if that truly bothered you, you would not be such a sucker for Russian propaganda.

[EGO_Aut]

You anti-US delusions fail to notice that all the recent gas deals to compensate in Europe are from Norway, North Africa and Middle East.

American fracking in majority for American market, plus Europe has it's own fracking reserves if things would get desperate in long term.

It is not only gas, it is profizzz.
Last year US fracking was not good enough to be profitable.
These days are gone - for years w/o NS pipelines. $$$$$

And we do not like fracking, better renewable energy - where its possible.

ATM there are some steel blast furnances(?) down to save gas - german automotive industry is nervous

@Falcrack
I do not know where you from, but which nation has the NATO supreme command in the EU?

Spoiler

Show

Always USA

[Warenwolf]

@Falcrack
I do not know where you from, but which nation has the NATO supreme command in the EU?

Spoiler

Show

Always USA

Would it be better if Putin was calling the shots in Europe?

[Cpt.Jericho]

Would it be better if Putin was calling the shots in Europe?

Moot point, with NS1+2 destroyed we'll never know.

[UnknownObject]

Even in the current grim time humor has its place. It's hilarious!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fzLFK0hXOZ8
English subtitles are available.