Discovery Season 2 (spoilers likely)

[Usenko]

Yeah. I'd call it a C (but we've had a run of high Bs and As, so this isn't a big problem, unless it's the first of a run of weak ones).

As for the plot:

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* I think the Tilly plot was okay. She became a bit too attached to her mycelial friend a bit too quickly, but the fact that she wanted to help out was very much in keeping with her character.

* I struggle with gay relationships at the best of times, but with that in mind even I could see that the Stamets/Culber relationship was acted beautifully.

* I agree that having Culber in the Myclial network permanently would be a better dramatic option. It would mean that Stamets had a difficult choice - since he knows that he can't be connected with the network without damaging it, does he ignore the damage and remain in contact with his love, or does he do what he knows to be right at the cost of never seeing Culber again?

[Ketraar]

So

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No one really dies in STD then I guess and everything is just pointless drama with no real lasting event.

In comparison I just rewatched Firefly and man STD sucks spaceballs.

MFG

Ketraar

[Morkonan]

So

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No one really dies in STD then I guess and everything is just pointless drama with no real lasting event.

In comparison I just rewatched Firefly and man STD sucks spaceballs.

I'm reminded of this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fhGfCpBcDzs

I'm man enough to admit it - Someone must have been slicing onions when I watched that.

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Sometimes, they have to die. If they don't, the story isn't a good story. If the story is written for a character to die, then... they should friggin' die. Even if it hurts. Maybe, because it would hurt.

[esd]

I thought that the Ba'ul...

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were gonna be evolved Kelpians.

I was wrong.

[Bishop149]

I thought that the Ba'ul...

I thought the same.

[pjknibbs]

Yeah, same, so good on the writers for wrong-footing our expectations, I suppose!

[Golden_Gonads]

The show has been renewed for a third season, which is expected to be out next year, as opposed to skipping a year again.

[berth]

The show has been renewed for a third season, which is expected to be out next year, as opposed to skipping a year again.

I'm quite surprised about that tbh, as I'm finding it pretty turgid compared to season 1.

Fingers crossed for the upcoming Picard thing though

[Usenko]

[Finally!] Just saw the Ba'ul episode. (It's been a busy week)

VERY Star-Trek. Enjoyable, and again, we were surprised we'd got to the end already!

[pjknibbs]

Hmmm, so Spock has finally made his appearance. Overall, I liked the episode, and the revelation at the end is interesting:

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So Spock wants to go to Talos IV? If I recall correctly the Discovery timeline is a couple of years past the original visit to that planet shown in "The Menagerie"/"The Cage", so one wonders why he wants to go back there.

[esd]

Prediction:

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Michael is the Red Angel.

[Ketraar]

Prediction:

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Michael is the Red Angel.

Yes this was made pretty obvious a few episodes ago. Sad bit is, they think its clever.

MFG

Ketraar

[berth]

Latest episode: much better imo. I thought the "previously on.." was a nice touch.

Now, I'm not really that steeped in ST lore. I mean, I've seen a lot of it, several times, but

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I thought Talos IV sounded familiar . It hadn't occurred to me that the OST Pike pilot and the later Kirk return to the planet were several years apart.

Also, I have a question

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on Vulcan ageing: Michael's memories of running away are, at most, what? 20 years old? Spock was a small child at the time. I thought Vulcans aged slowly, so how come he has matured, been around a bit, grown an experimental beard etc in the interim?

So, yeah, hitting its stride now, I hope. I'm also interested in the development of

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Hugh. It would have been so easy for the writers the go straight back to fluffy loved-up tweeness. I predict Saru is going to go full Rambo at some point too, possibly going out in a Hudson style blaze of glory .

[Redvers Ganderpoke]

Much better, but there is still something wrong, I find myself losing interest in the wordy bits, there is something soporific about those bits. But it getting more Star Trek and enjoyed the nod back to "The Cage".

They still to signal the plot to much. There's no surprises.

[Usenko]

They still to signal the plot to much. There's no surprises.

I agree with this, but I suggest it's not specific to Star Trek. This seems a weakness of many shows.

I wonder if it's an artefact of the streaming format? Maybe scriptwriters feel more of a need to tie everything together smoothly.

[pjknibbs]

Latest episode: much better imo. I thought the "previously on.." was a nice touch.

I actually thought it would have been cooler if they'd re-filmed those shots with the current cast and SFX, but nonetheless, a nice touch. And the plot is clearly kicking into high gear now.

[Xenon_Slayer]

Okay. I watched episode 9 last night and while it wasn't bad, a it featured several things which kind of bug me about this show.

First of all, it's the character development of the "secondary" characters. Star Trek has always had a few side characters who are introduced in an episode and then utilised and fleshed out later, a typical 'recurring character'. They build up over time and eventually may be as well known and loved as a main character. They would never be used as an emotial bludgeon in the story unless they were actually of value to the audiance.

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This is my problem with how they handled Commander Airiam in the latest episode, or rather, how they handled these very visible and present side-characters in the 1 and a half season run they've had so far. After all this time, I would at least like to know "what species is this character?", "Is she an android with no emotions or an enhanced humanoid?". Sure, we got some of these answers during moments of this episode, but why resort to shoe-horning it in for the final episode we're going to see this character? Why did we not get any of this before? Yes, the seasons are shorter than the Star Trek we're used to and that means they have to pick and choose who to develop, but then don't have story beats to make us care about a character we barely even know.

That's not to say that I didn't care by the end of the episode. If anything, I was hoping for some deus ex machina so we could see more character development of Airiam, but alas, it seems that they forgot that they have a magical teleportation device to scoop people out of the cold void of space. (I assume their transporters were still operational as they beamed in minutes earlier).

That would be another thing which is somewhat annoying. Technology which is either conveniently there for story purposes or suddenly missing without anyone batting an eyelid. The thermal data apparently transmitted during viewscreen transmissions not only cleared up their immediate situation, but also cleared up the issue with Spock. And I totally get that Star Trek is the king of coming up with technobabble, but that just came across as a bit forced.

All that said, I am enjoying the show. I just feel that it's cutting too many narative corners while having to deal with short seasons and trying to present 'serious' stories.

[Usenko]

I think you're right - the big problem they have is trying to deal with a subtly different new medium (streaming video). It offers opportunities you didn't have before (e.g. you'll have a significant number of audience members who will binge watch the entire series in a few sittings, making it possible to treat the show like a long movie in instalments rather than discrete episodes), but it also gives you difficulties (in that there's much less time available to the filmmakers to build their world and develop characters).

[Morkonan]

I think you're right - the big problem they have is trying to deal with a subtly different new medium (streaming video). It offers opportunities you didn't have before (e.g. you'll have a significant number of audience members who will binge watch the entire series in a few sittings, making it possible to treat the show like a long movie in instalments rather than discrete episodes), but it also gives you difficulties (in that there's much less time available to the filmmakers to build their world and develop characters).

^--- This is A Big Deal ™.

With streaming and video-on-demand services, producers are paying a bit more attention to a show's "streamability." Not saying it's necessarily the case above, since I don't watch the series. But, I'm sure that is a consideration they're not ignoring.

In ST:ToS, we never met Scotty's parents. Heck, we didn't know a great deal about most of the characters. Some had some back-story brought in for episodes and it was "refreshing." In TNG, they practically gang-raped the private history of the entire crew, digging up everything and regurgitating it onto the screen, just in case they could get some more fan loyalty based on their interest in that character. They expanded on that, really "getting into it" with Troi or Worf being the usual gimmick. Troi really only because Majel Barrett did such a good job and Worf because.. "Klingon Ugg, Me Smash, But Me Thinking Klingon, Not Always Smashing Klingon... Worf only pawn in game of life."

All that wasn't really that terrible back then. It was "different" from the Star Trek we all knew. But, now? It's tiring... It makes things "not happen." They have to stop the "action" to move to a quiet place so the audience can consume and digest a character's backstory and why it's necessary for what's being told on the screen, which is usually BS that's just there to "develop the character."

Fifty-eleven light-years of character development goes nowhere.

"All docking clamps released, Captain. Spacedock signals we are clear for departure."
"Station-keeping, Pilot! We have yet to discuss Ensign Pulver's tragic backstory of disaster and abandonment that explains his strange Gnome Fetish."

But, you'll sit through a few of those episodes if you can watch them without having to get up from the couch. And, maybe you'll get hooked on Pulver's Gnome Fetish?

[Ketraar]

Streaming is not the issue at all, the writing is. STD is a convoluted shallow series that puts huge effort in visuals and hardly any in writing. Then its inconsistent to what they want the characters to be, they started off Michael as a discount Spock but neither the actor nor the writers new what made Spock iconic. Just the fact that they didn't realize that the acronym of the series would be that of a sexually transmitted disease, tells you everything about how thought out the whole thing is (not). Even though the second series is much less bad than the 1st its still bad and if one removes the nostalgia factor out, one realizes how poor the series is.

MFG

Ketraar