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Posted: Tue, 20. May 08, 17:45
by pjknibbs
That refire rate on the mobile drill is perfectly normal, yes--the weapon is actually pretty powerful, so if it had a fast rate of fire it would be better than most military weapons! As for the other, I suspect that "Scan Asteroids" is a Bonus Pack command and may not be recognising the presence of the pre-installed mineral scanner. The scanner will still actually work--if you go within 10km of an unscanned asteroid, target it, and press I for information, does the asteroid scan correctly?

Re: Mineral Scanner missing yet present? a bug?

Posted: Tue, 20. May 08, 18:00
by jlehtone
:headbang: :oops:
Starhaus wrote:With a mineral scanner installed in any ship (I know this from using it in other ships), opening the special commands panel gives the option to "scan asteroids".
"Scan Asteroids" command is part of "Explorer Software" script. It requires the 'Explorer Software' (from Teladi Docks) on the ship and

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if $ship -> get amount of ware Mineral Scanner in cargo bay
nothing else. No recollection if that test succeeds for builtins.

Posted: Tue, 20. May 08, 19:09
by Starhaus
Ah, I see. Explorer software. My Mamba had it but the Demeter did not. However, the prereq list does not mention explorer software. If you click on the greyed out (unusable) options of "collect minerals" or "scan asteroids" there is no mention of "explorer software" in the prereq list.

Posted: Tue, 20. May 08, 19:21
by Starhaus
Ok, I added explorer software to the Demeter, and although the "scan asteroids" option appears in the command list, it is still greyed out and unusable directly. However, that option was directly usable in my other personal ship. Clicking on the greyed out option simply gives a blurb about how "scanning asteroids has never been easier...". No prereq list. I think prior to the explorer extension, the "scan asteroid" option was not even available, although "collect minerals" was (although greyed out).

It is an idiosyncratic inconsistency that one ship can directly use the option and another can not. The exception is counter-intuitive as well, since one would expect to be able to directly scan asteroids from a mining ship. Is there a list of exceptions to availability for various options? (Or perhaps is it, as was mentioned earlier, simply a glitch resulting from the extension not recognising a pre-installed scanner?)

Posted: Tue, 20. May 08, 19:25
by Nanook
I've never had a problem with any of my miner-class ships using the 'Collect Minerals in Sector' command. Above and beyond what the miner-class ships come with, it only requires Special Command Software. Are you sure you have that on your Demeter Miner? Do you have any other scripts installed besides the Bonus Pack that might interfere with the command? Any mods? Has the ship ever been used for another purpose, such as CLS, CAG, ST/UT? If so, there may still be an active script on it overriding the mining script. I really can't think of a reason the option would be there but greyed out. :?

Posted: Tue, 20. May 08, 19:37
by Starhaus
I am running just the latest Steam version of X3 (ver 2.5) with the latest bonus pack listed on the home page of this site. I have pretty much every other trade or commercial type of extension for the Demeter Miner. And yes, it is a vanilla Demeter Miner with mineral scanner and ore collector preinstalled.

The "scan asteroids" option was directly selectable when available in my Mamba Raider, but it is not available (greyed out) in my mining ship. How is that for logic? Fortunately, I had used my Mamba earlier to scan most asteroids in the sectors I passed through. I just found it inconvenient not to be able to scan asteroids with my mining ship proper.

Posted: Tue, 20. May 08, 19:48
by Starhaus
I did try using the manual method however, and that does work. Pressing "i" for each individual asteroid, one by one, will slowly allow me to gather the ore yield value for each asteroid in the scanner database. It is a ridiculously slow process to scan each asteroid manually though, which is why I would like to know why the automated software for this does not work the same way as with other ships.

Posted: Tue, 20. May 08, 22:06
by jlehtone
@Starhaus: You are correct, there is a bug. It was actually noticed before Bonuspack 3.1.07, and it was fixed. However, somehow the buggy older file was never replaced with the fixed one when the BP 3.1.07 was packaged.

The bug is in the "Explorer Software" script and prevents ships with builtin Mineral Scanner from using the "Scan Asteroids" command. The other Explorer Software commands: "Explore Sector .." and "Fly through gate .." do work. These commands are entirely unrelated to the "Mobile Mining / Mineral Collection Software" script.

The "Collect Minerals" command of "Mobile Mining / Mineral Collection Software" script works on ships with builtin Mineral Scanner.

It is the difference between

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get true amount of ware

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get amount of ware

I've always used Discoverer for the scanning duty (except the one time I did use Hyperion, which was silently eaten by Xenon, RIP). It feels somehow more proper to use a Scout for exploration duty. Plus it is a bit faster too.

Posted: Wed, 21. May 08, 02:53
by Starhaus
That is what I suspected. There is another anomalous aspect to this as well (or perhaps a separate bug):

When I dock another ship that has the special command software mk1 at the same station with the Demeter Miner (which also has this software), and when I open the freight exchange information window, - in the database list of installed extensions at the top, the special command software is accurately reported as being present on both ships, but in the bar graph at the bottom, it shows the special command software (also a preinstalled item in the Demeter Miner i believe), as missing in the Demeter.

It would seem the preinstalled special software mk 1 is not properly acknowledged in different areas. As a result of this, at the very least, should I want to transfer the extension to a ship that doesnt have it, I would not be able to. Since I don't know how all these scripts interact, I am not sure if this also impacts the absence of the "scan asteroids" option in the special commands menu.

Posted: Wed, 21. May 08, 03:01
by Nanook
I think this is normal. No preinstalled equipment can be transferred to another ship. That includes all the Trade Command Mk I's on the TS's, TP's and TL's, as well as things like Fight Cmd Mk I & II and the Triplex Scanners on Raider class fighters, just to mention a couple of examples. The reason it appears as 'missing' in the bar at the bottom is because it cannot be transferred. It's just a minor display idiosyncracy to get used to, since it's true, as I said, for all preinstalled and hence permanent equipment on ships.

Posted: Mon, 9. Jun 08, 20:07
by kotekzot
could it be possible to have ships utilize more of the transporter's device range to collect rocks? most of the time ships IS just fly around on collision detection. still a great script though.

Posted: Mon, 9. Jun 08, 21:35
by jlehtone
kotekzot wrote:could it be possible to have ships utilize more of the transporter's device range to collect rocks?
While possible, it sounds unlikely, at least for the signed version. This script is already very handy and lucrative.

Btw, as I wrote earlier, I had this script collect 53,776 units of Nividium in 36.5 hours. One Kha'ak sector and IS all the time. Plenty of collision detection, but still quite nice collection rate.

Posted: Fri, 13. Jun 08, 10:35
by Bunny
Two attempts were made at implementing the transporter idea. However, no solution was found to the
"ghost rocks" that persisted in sector after the rock had been beam "collected". It was necessary to leave and reenter the system to remove them which was not a practical solution.

Also the script has to deal with debris objects rather than the rocks. This gives rise to a number of technical difficulties because there is not a one to one correlation between them i.e. one debris object can be composed of several rocks (which themselves can be in various stages of fragmentation)...

In short, the existing script is a pretty good solution to a very awkward problem :)

Posted: Fri, 13. Jun 08, 11:12
by kotekzot
i see. well, it's still brilliant as it is.

Posted: Fri, 13. Jun 08, 23:03
by Bishop149
Sorry if I'm missing something thats already been said but I can't see it anywhere.

I have two miners (Dolphins) assigned with a TL as a homebase, and a fighter to break up the rocks, they all seem to be doing their jobs nicely but the two miners have not made a single delivery to the TL yet.

How does this work, do their cargobays have to be over a certain % full or something? If so what? Any calcification would be appreciated!