X2 Vs Freelancer.

General discussions about the games by Egosoft including X-BTF, XT, X², X³: Reunion, X³: Terran Conflict and X³: Albion Prelude.

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rustamk
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Post by rustamk » Sat, 23. Oct 04, 13:28

As I switched to X2 only recently this is what I say:

Things I miss from Freelancer:

Nav-Points
Plot
Feel of life - Radio Chatter, rogue fights, hailing system
Feel of mystery - How do you feel when you visit a Nomad sector, or fly through Tau-31, even in the best of ships, you are praying to god for that pirate squadron not to notice you! In X2 you are not afraid of visiting the Xenon in a Spacesiut, as someone pointed out in another thread. :lol:
Music - Awesome in systems and during fights.
Smooth graphics
Mouse Support - I think this was the best feature in freelancer, the way I could target something by moving the mouse and stuff like that.
Short Cut Keys Remap - I cant believe they missed this one out!

Things that I hail in X2

Capital Ships and multiple ships
Own stations

Rustam
Last edited by rustamk on Sat, 23. Oct 04, 20:16, edited 1 time in total.

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giskard
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Post by giskard » Sat, 23. Oct 04, 18:29

rustamk:

I would have to agree with all your points there, i liked all those aspects of Freelancer.

On the subject of unrealistic, I am a big supporter of Devs using some artistic licience when it improves a game. Id rather my games be fun than accurate any day.

However planet sizes in Freelancer where unrealistic.
In some cases you could fit an enter sector into an area thats about the same as the area Earth and its moon takes up.

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duriel
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Post by duriel » Sat, 23. Oct 04, 19:40

I'm not sure why people liked the mouse flight system in FL. I suppose it makes it easier but it just didn't seem like i flying a ship. Just pointing the mouse at what i wanted to fly at just reduced the skill in piloting. The flight system was done to appeal to the masses and so the people who couldn't manage normal flight games could play. Basically the dumbed the control system down to the point where everyone could be an ace pilot.

The list rustamk gave has good pionts. I'm not sure what you'd nav points for though. I guess you could plot it so you could avoid certain pireate sector rather it taking you the most direct route but you just get a jumpdrive.

One of my biggest problems with what people about Freelancer and want in X2 is, Does it fit with what we already have or what has been built up of the history in the X Universe. Just because a feature fitted and worked well in one game doesn't mean it would work well or fit into another game.


Neil.

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Post by spence336 » Sat, 23. Oct 04, 22:22

i found it odd that planets could be 80mk away from each other and not crash together and blow up, but hey its a game
ships;
1 teladi osprey 5 pirate ships
1 paranid nemesis 1 argon nova
1 argon centaur 1 argon discoverer
1 split mamba 1 boron barracuda
1 split scorpoin 1 boron manta
2 paranid pegasus' 2 boron dolphins

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Post by Myo » Sat, 23. Oct 04, 22:41

Amen, rustamk.

Especially on this point:
Feel of mystery - How do you feel when you visit a Nomad sector, or fly through Tau-31, even in the best of ships, you are praying to god for that pirate squadron not to notice you! In X2 you are not afraid of visiting the Xenon in a Spacesuit, as someone pointed out in another thread.
On several occassions have I been flying through a sector, desparately trying to avoid the patrolling wings of enemies and find that jumphole that I know is around somewhere, but is hidden by the nebula gases(especially on some servers; like the Jolt server, which is modded so that enemies are MUCH harder. Hessians in sabres with lvl 10 shields armed with a tizona, a missile launcher and a load of nomads weapons; anyone? :o Oh, and of course the obligatory cruise-disruptors to prevent your escape. :( )

X2 sorta doesn't have that sort of tension. If you're not flying through in a destroyer or corvette (to take them on easily), you can just jump out. And if you've not got a jumpdrive, its never far to a gate...

Having said that, I think its a bit stupid the way you can only have one ship in Freelancer. Thats what I like about X2, fleets. :)
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rustamk
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Post by rustamk » Sat, 23. Oct 04, 23:35

I will elaborate a bit.

True, I like the multiple ship capability in X2, it would be cool if you could hire wingmen in Freelancer (still keeping it "Freelancer", charge by every hour or gate crossed or something like that) and if you could get something more than a fighter. I suppose that that is what makes X2 easier. That Rhineland Battleship looked awesome!


Also, the plot was sooooo much better in freelancer. You were really surprised by the plot from time to time. Like that time when you have to excape from manhattan, and the Battleship Unity is waiting. Or that time when you go to that science planet to get the artifact and the woman scientist and the Rhineland Valkyries suddenly uncloak, or the Planet Toledo Fight... so exciting... Or the time when... Endless stories...

The jump drive is a real spoiler. A pirate heavy fighter should be what it says it is: A pirate heavy fighter. Not something that can be taken out with 5 shots of a Nova! You remember in systems like Leeds system, (I've flown a lot there, there was an excellent trade route there, From leeds to Manhattan) I usually flew through that system, Magellan, and there was a nebula with lots of pirates, pirates that take you out in seconds if you dont have a good enough afterburner, even though there was a ton of police ships near the planet itself. So, reaching the gate was a challenge, and then you didn't know what to expect on the other side! In X2 in "High danger sectors" you have wither a couple of bayamons that cant even take down 5MW shields, with an orinoco or two which doesnt attack anything anyway. Near xenon sectors you have a bunch of telletubbie strenght Ms and Ls.

The music was full of excitement and character. Flying through the badlands you had that dark, mysterious sound, so dark, so evil... Fighting in corsair sectors gave you that other tone, really nice. Really added a lot to the game.

I really think that X2 is a step... But a step in one place. On one hand there is some really exciting stuff like multiple and cap ships, on the other, there is the nightmare of things that haunt me. Nevertheless, a great game.

I must say, I like X2, and when I was a 30k homeless the stuff brought me a lot of fun, and I looked forward to my first corvette and cap ship. After I got my Nova I made 20 mils in a jiffy. Just 30 more mils and I will have that phoenix which will wipe out the whole universe by itself. Or maybe two.

I was going to write more about problems with X2, but I thought that some people might take it the wrong way, because truly, I like X2. I have not played Freelancer in a long time because my CD got broken, so I cannot compare. All I was going to say was that factories that cost millions that take days to earn only make a penny an hour, which makes me want to ditch them. And also, I was going to say something about the unability to remap keys, but I will not say more than this.

Rustam

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giskard
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Post by giskard » Sun, 24. Oct 04, 03:09

Nothing wrong with expressing an opinion rustamk :)

Every sane individual has an opinion and will respect your right to have one too. Only the truely anal would cause your problems for expressing that opinion (within the forums rules of course).

Duriel: dont you find it funny that in Freelancer the complained about lack Joystick support and in X2 they complain about bad mouse support. Yet here we are after playing with a mouse in one game and joystick in another.

Guess im of the mouse and joystick generation or something and some folk are from the console generation which has totally different controls.

But then again perhaps im totally wrong....

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Post by Greyhawk1 » Sun, 24. Oct 04, 04:21

I was going to buy FL until I found out it was third person. The word "ugh!" springs to mind. Totally unrealistic viewpoint to play a game IMO.

Even if the FL universe was awesome I still couldnt play it third person...
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overlord_stu
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Post by overlord_stu » Sun, 24. Oct 04, 05:45

I think some people are too rigid in what they 'like' and 'dislike' about games and arent willing to open themselves up to trying a new experience :) - I am an avid fan of space sims from Elite through to X2 and FL.

I think both games have incredibly strong merits, and are designed to do two different things...X2 gives you absolute control over almost anything you could possibly own (or want to own) and allows you to trade or fight as you see fit without forcing it on you every five seconds...where freelancer gives you almost constant action with a lot less of the management and admin functions in running your empire as you only get the one ship etc.

Comparing these games is useful from certain points of view and from a very vague 'they are both open ended space games type view', but as someone said earlier, they are not meant to be exactly alike in what they offer the player (apart from being generally open ended space sims). I play both X2 and FL regularly and I find blowing up pirates and stuff in FL a welcome distraction from the headaches of my wayward supply TP & TLs getting shot-up by Khaak, and likewise when the constant 'fight after fight' and lack of depth of FL hits me, then I go to X2 to give me the 'Empire' I have always wanted to command and the feeling of being in control.

Both games have their good and bad points for me, of which most people have covered the most obvious and even the not so obvious...All I wanted to say was that both games and many before them are excellent games to play - but even with unlimited time and resources, you will never please everyone. I take to my hat off to all developers that brave the forums after their 'creation' gets praised and destroyed just as quickly as the next post is written!! I think both games are great and will live long past most other games on my PC! :D

sorry it went on a bit!! :o - This thread in general does make some very good reading though :)
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Holliday
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Post by Holliday » Sun, 24. Oct 04, 05:46

I think this is the third time in this thread this has been mentioned, but Freelancer has a first person option. Ctrl V puts you in the cockpit. Not much of a cockpit, but enough to make it first person.
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Post by darkmaster » Sun, 24. Oct 04, 09:09

Holliday wrote:I think this is the third time in this thread this has been mentioned, but Freelancer has a first person option. Ctrl V puts you in the cockpit. Not much of a cockpit, but enough to make it first person.
Yes, but is a bit unplayable in that view, you can see the game is not designed to play in that view.
But, of course, as everyone pointed, x2 and freelancer are two different games, and some choices are not to be discussed.
If it was decided to do that way they had their reasons.
Same for x2.
But what can make a game better is to add what it miss, I think, rather than change taken decisions.
And I think x2 miss a more living universe (size and interaction).

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Post by duriel » Sun, 24. Oct 04, 12:12

I think certain things relating to size an dinteraction will be changed in The Return. They have plans to increase sector sizes in the outer secotrs i think and i expect there to be more secrets to explore. I've also read that there will be more sectors aswell.

I'd wait until The Return before fuly judging X2.

Freelancer is the first game in the series (and maybe the last). X2 is the second and each game will have an expansion. Egosoft have got to be doing something right for this to have happened and as freelancer looks like it's not getting a sequal mayeb they didn't do as much right a people claim.

Giskard> I"m of the keyboard and joystick generation so using a mouse for a flight game seemed alien to me. I fly on X2 using the keyboard and will continue to do so.

Neil

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Post by Nyax » Sun, 24. Oct 04, 13:55

and as freelancer looks like it's not getting a sequal mayeb they didn't do as much right a people claim.
Or maybe Freelancer just cost a lot more to make then X and X2 (god knows, it shows). I'll bet good money Freelancer sold far more copies then X2 ever has, but given the likely difference in production costs i'm sure Egosoft and Microsoft have very different ideas about what constitutes a 'Success' for each game.

rustamk
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Post by rustamk » Sun, 24. Oct 04, 13:56

If only I could compare and contrast the new and the old versions of "Romeo and Juliet" films as well as I can compare and contrast Freelancer and X2, I would get an A*A* in english... 8)

Anyways, yeah, FL is more combat oriented, I cannot argue with that. And X2 is an empire-manager kinda game. So, I guess they are different games, but not entirely. They could have still included mouse and joystick support in every game to make everyone happy... is that really so hard? Or to let you re-map keys. Or to let you have more than one ship.

With the technology avialable today, especially to the leading game designers, I do not understand why nobody can make a "perfect" game that could suit anyone, I mean, it is just a 100 or 1000 lines of code to let you have wingmen... or mouse support, with the money they spend on copyright protection that wouldn't be a problem. I hope the Return will imporove on the flows of X2.

And I also realise that sooner or later my X2 CD will get broken too. There is a small plastic drop on it already, as if the paint has melted and made that drop, on the "nice" side of the CD. And then what... :oops: :oops: :oops:

Rustam

rustamk
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Post by rustamk » Sun, 24. Oct 04, 14:03

Interesting point, nyax.

Rustam

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