Reelase all previous games with the new engine?

General discussions about the games by Egosoft including X-BTF, XT, X², X³: Reunion, X³: Terran Conflict and X³: Albion Prelude.

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Post by jlehtone » Tue, 18. Sep 18, 20:39

Wiki: "GLX is an extension to the X Window System core protocol providing an interface between OpenGL and the X Window System as well as extensions to OpenGL itself."

Your OS update has (probably) changed the versions of X Window System and OpenGL and hence version of GLX. The binary probably uses parameters that are no longer valid in the new versions.

Similarly, the binary has been linked against specific shared library versions. The new versions need/may not be backward compatible. Symlinks could fool the system, but if the incompatibility is real, then anything can happen, just like with the GLX.

Whenever I partition a brand-new system, I always leave space for "other systems". Thus I can install next OS "on the side" rather than "overwrite". I know, hindsight is always a bit late.

PS. Is this Tech Support's issue now?

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Post by Eduarde Calibal » Tue, 18. Sep 18, 20:50

Before this post I tried the same path, after all links made I collect dozen of pages of errors and a crash in the end... Don't is a good path of action. :-/
If I have experience in reverse engineering I will uncompile and after recompile with the new libraries but don't is a easy plan anyway. :-o

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Post by Alan Phipps » Tue, 18. Sep 18, 23:52

"PS. Is this Tech Support's issue now?"

Yes it probably is now, but it needs to be retitled as an X2 Linux issue otherwise the thread wouldn't seem to make sense there nor attract the right sort of help. I can sort all that out for the OP and move it back there if he wants me to.
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Post by ubuntufreakdragon » Wed, 19. Sep 18, 02:27

e.g. "X2 debian linux missing libaries startup fail"
And the problem description + OS info should be copied in the first post.
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Post by Timsup2nothin » Wed, 19. Sep 18, 06:04

Punt. :D
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Post by hisazul » Thu, 20. Sep 18, 06:18

Xenon_Slayer wrote:
linolafett wrote:No chance.
Pretty much. But to go into a bit more detail (but not much because I have things to do with X4 ironically).

If you wanted to make a X-BtF 'remake' in the new engine, even with the old visuals, the would mean at least:

- Recreating what an 'object' is as ships/stations/sectors are all vastly constructs in the new engine
- Recreating the whole plot in a different language
- Reprogramming all the AI in a different language
- Attempt to recreate the universe in an engine with different gameworld structure (although this may be one of the more simple problems)
- Lock the player out the "fly multiple ships" feature :roll:

And while I said "even with the old visuals", I doubt our engine can even deal with those files, so they would most likely need to be worked on.

And then each game after that got even more complicated, so X3AP in the new engine would be an Argon Mammoth task.
Its like making a tricycle with Bugatti parts or Bugatti with tricycle parts. Which ever way tickles your fancy.

I also don't really get why people want classics released on new engine... it takes away, from both the game and developers. Funny thing... I hated BtF enough to not look at X series until X2... knowing that I thought I wouldn't play Rebirth considering all the stuff that was mentioned before release... and I ended up not just playing it but I also enjoyed it, a lot. Same exact idea, X:R may as well be X:BtF reboot but the feeling is VASTLY different. Hence why I don't get these requests in the first place. Morrowind on "better" engine may sound nice but too much would be lost, too much of what made Morrowind the kind of one time experience that it was that will probably never get beat by anything.
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Post by ConorC » Thu, 20. Sep 18, 11:22

As a follow on from hisazul's point, we view old games through the perspective of nostalgia, not realizing that systems and methods have slowy evolved over many years and we have evolved with them. For example, one of my favorite games of all time is Hidden and Dangerous 2 from way back in 2003. I recently picked it up on steam for a couple of euros, rather than sitting through an hour of installing off 3 CDs, and fired it up and OH MY GOD the control system is atrocious, I remember loving this game but now I find it virtually unplayable. I can still see a lot of what I loved about it but I think I will just leave it in my memory, where the game is pristine in it's awesomeness.

Conversely, the remastered version of Homeworld, which looks fantastic, does not play as well as the original, so what do I know?

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Post by Mazryonh » Thu, 20. Sep 18, 23:44

I personally would love to see the X Trilogy remastered in a newer engine and made compatible with newer operating systems. X3: Reunion especially, because its main plot had some problems that could use a do-over, including the chance to add cut content (such as the Earth getting fired upon by what appears to be an M0 Planet-Killer) back in. Or even X3: Reunion being pushed back to a newer version of X2 to become X2: The Return like it was originally going to be.

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Re: Reelase all previous games with the new engine?

Post by Alan Phipps » Sun, 4. Nov 18, 22:32

@ BlackArchon: There are old discussions, and even older discussions on such topics. Remember that XbtF to X3AP all had similar XP OS era game engines.
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Re: Reelase all previous games with the new engine?

Post by BlackArchon » Sun, 4. Nov 18, 22:52

I see these old discussions from ten years ago. But maybe something has changed at Egosoft?
The age of the game engines is irrelevant. Their source code could be the base for a fan-made remake of the older games, of course with some modifications if necessary.

However, being a software developer myself I can understand that maybe Egosoft isn't too keen on releasing the source code of one of their first products. I wouldn't either do it so easily... because I'm a bit ashamed on how I did things ten or twenty years ago. That I can understand. :)

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Re: Reelase all previous games with the new engine?

Post by Honved » Tue, 6. Nov 18, 18:02

First, there is no money to be made by recreating an existing game all over again. Remaking an old game would take ALMOST as much time as making a game from scratch, and the time (and expense) are better off being put toward a new game.

Second, unless there is some drastic improvement in the game that the new engine will allow, without changing anything else, why not just play the old game?

There is definitely an element of nostalgia about older games, but there are also ideas which were good at the time and are STILL good. My typical example of that is Morrowind: the graphics are almost painful by modern standards, and the game engine clearly has its limitations, but there were several fundamental elements of gameplay which have not been matched in the later titles (some for good reason, but others are sorely missed). A new engine might solve some of the animation problems, but the temptation would be to remake the game with more "modern" gameplay (more emphasis on action, less on RP and consequences), which would destroy the very things that made it a classic in the first place. Since there are already THOUSANDS of mods to improve the graphics and fix many of the problems with the game, the reinvention of the wheel simply isn't necessary, and probably wouldn't pay the developers to attempt. Unfortunately, console players can't take advantage of the mods,, but that element alone isn't enough to pay for remaking the old classic.

I'd rather see EGOSOFT pour another several thousand hours of effort into improving the next game in the series, rather than trying to fix an older game that only a few die-hard fans will re-buy. For those few, making sure that the elements that made the previous games good in the first place are included in the next new title would be a major consideration. Clearly, that point was missed with the release of XR, but it looks like EGOSOFT has been trying to rectify the omission ever since.

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