[WIP][Tutorial] Building your own ship for dummies 2

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Axeface
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Re: [WIP][Tutorial] Building your own ship for dummies

Post by Axeface » Wed, 4. Mar 20, 14:48

Thanks loads for this tutorial. Its been a big help but im having lots of problems. Rambling wall of text incoming...

Im having major problems getting to grips with exporting my ship. Feels like ive been smashing my face against a brick wall for the last few days... my model is reaching somewhere i'de accept as complete, so I started to try to figure out how to add cockpits, landing gear etc to it.

Firstly, constant scale and rotation issues. I think its a combination of my complete lack of knowledge about xmls and x4 modding in general, an export/import issue with blender vs 3dsmax and also issues im having with blender and its parenting features (im new to blender). The rotation of parts of my ship are being changed in a way I dont understand - everything can look fine in blender but when I export and get something in game the axis are often changed for the whole thing or more importantly, only SOME parts of my ship. It seems that there might be an issue with axis in blender. Blender dae export has options for global orientation and an 'apply global orientation' checkbox - why there is a checkbox AND options for global orientation I dont know. Ive had some success getting this to apply a bandage fix to my rotation problems, but only sometimes.
The process of troubleshooting this is torturous, maybe im just blind or stupid and the solution is very simple but im not finding it.

Secondly. I moved away from replacing another modded ship and tried to export my ship properly and generate its xml from 'scratch' as an experiment. Ship not working in-game, its mesh is invisible and it wont build in the wharf. I assume this is because my xml is broken because I simply dont know what im doing. I have to manually add engines thrusters and shields to the xml, but it still refuses to build in game.

Lastly, FYI I have been experimenting with export from blender 2.8 only and I got it to work... sometimes. As explained in previous posts Blender 2.8 collada/dae export doesnt have the 'UV Textures' drop down box option. It does have a checkbox however with 'Only selected UV map' - clicking this allowed me to successfully export and then convert some of my experiments, but only some of them - a few still got the "expected attribute "texcoord" at element "texture" error message in the converter.

Anyways, Im not sure what the point of this post was - a general cry for help I guess. This technical stuff is a nightmare and its causing me considerable stress, I really enjoy modeling but everything related to actually getting something in-game is excruciating. I can only hope and pray for official support to make the process easier (an exporter that can just generate an entire working xml including shields, engines, thrusters would be a godsend). A hand-holding tutorial about ripping things like cockpits and landing gear off other ships, moving and scaling them to fit our ships and then exporting them properly would also be a godsend.
The AI revolution cant come fast enough.... to free us from this technical garbage and let people who just want to create things just create things and not get bogged down in xmls and other torturous **** :evil:

If anyones interested heres my ship model as it currently stands 12 (sound volume warning, i was listening to music at the time of recording).

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Re: [WIP][Tutorial] Building your own ship for dummies

Post by BrummBear02 » Wed, 4. Mar 20, 20:51

the rotation and scale thing happens when u pull one node into another. the global rotation ans cale doesnt get updated correctly in the .dae or something. idk. i also had issues with that. i worked around that by making copys of nodes and merging meshes.

I never tried the generated xml. reusing existing xml files works fine for me so there is no reason to. McBain uses the generated ones as far as i know. u might wanna talk to him?

i dont know shit about blender 2.8, never tried it and honestly i dont really care much about it. im happy with 2.7x :)

U cant add landing gear from other ships. at least not their animations. i talked about that in the tutorial. replacing the mesh of the landing gear is no problem. just do as usual and deactivate its collision.

i didnt finish this tutorial since there are very few people interested in actually making ships and the few who are usually ask me on discord where i happily help them. u might wanna visit there. its a lot easier to explain things because i can share my screen and send screenshots way more conviniently
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ALEX Bemelmans
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Re: [WIP][Tutorial] Building your own ship for dummies

Post by ALEX Bemelmans » Fri, 1. May 20, 22:52

hi when i want to export my dae with xrconvertermain i have the error expected attribute "texcoord" at element "texture"
my textid range: 909700-909799

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Re: [WIP][Tutorial] Building your own ship for dummies

Post by BrummBear02 » Sat, 2. May 20, 06:28

ALEX Bemelmans wrote:
Fri, 1. May 20, 22:52
hi when i want to export my dae with xrconvertermain i have the error expected attribute "texcoord" at element "texture"
u didnt select "UV Textures" in the export options in blender and left it at "Materials"
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Re: [WIP][Tutorial] Building your own ship for dummies

Post by BrummBear02 » Sat, 2. May 20, 06:29

Axeface wrote:
Wed, 4. Mar 20, 14:48

If anyones interested heres my ship model as it currently stands 12 (sound volume warning, i was listening to music at the time of recording).

How is your ship coming along?
Gebt mir einen Spiegel dann schlage ich ihn mit seinem eigenen Gesicht

Mycu
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Re: [WIP][Tutorial] Building your own ship for dummies

Post by Mycu » Sat, 2. May 20, 07:37

Axeface wrote:
Wed, 4. Mar 20, 14:48
If anyones interested heres my ship model as it currently stands 12 (sound volume warning, i was listening to music at the time of recording).
This Centaur looks sexy AF... Hope to see it in my game some day.
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Axeface
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Re: [WIP][Tutorial] Building your own ship for dummies

Post by Axeface » Sat, 2. May 20, 07:39

BrummBear02 wrote:
Sat, 2. May 20, 06:29
How is your ship coming along?
Oh I gave up with it months ago, was causing me way too much stress.

ALEX Bemelmans
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Re: [WIP][Tutorial] Building your own ship for dummies

Post by ALEX Bemelmans » Sat, 2. May 20, 13:03

BrummBear02 wrote:
Sat, 2. May 20, 06:28
ALEX Bemelmans wrote:
Fri, 1. May 20, 22:52
hi when i want to export my dae with xrconvertermain i have the error expected attribute "texcoord" at element "texture"
u didnt select "UV Textures" in the export options in blender and left it at "Materials"
i don t have this option but "only selected uv map" and "copy" in texture i tried both/none/only first/only second and same result... after rereading all post i see that axeface got same problem....
Axeface wrote:
Sat, 2. May 20, 07:39

Oh I gave up with it months ago, was causing me way too much stress.

it s funny i m trying to do with the vulture exactly the same you did with the centaur. if you gave up please give me your asset and tell me what you did to have it work
vulture defreightered
Show
Image
with defreightering them and we have a whole new type of ship
my textid range: 909700-909799

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Re: [WIP][Tutorial] Building your own ship for dummies

Post by Axeface » Mon, 4. May 20, 18:06

ALEX Bemelmans wrote:
Sat, 2. May 20, 13:03
BrummBear02 wrote:
Sat, 2. May 20, 06:28
ALEX Bemelmans wrote:
Fri, 1. May 20, 22:52
hi when i want to export my dae with xrconvertermain i have the error expected attribute "texcoord" at element "texture"
u didnt select "UV Textures" in the export options in blender and left it at "Materials"
i don t have this option but "only selected uv map" and "copy" in texture i tried both/none/only first/only second and same result... after rereading all post i see that axeface got same problem....
Axeface wrote:
Sat, 2. May 20, 07:39

Oh I gave up with it months ago, was causing me way too much stress.

it s funny i m trying to do with the vulture exactly the same you did with the centaur. if you gave up please give me your asset and tell me what you did to have it work
vulture defreightered
Show
Image
with defreightering them and we have a whole new type of ship
You need to use blender 2.7 not 2.8 to get the uv textures option (its very annoying to have to do this extra step). Export your model from 2.8 and then import export from 2.7.
To get the model ingame I did what brummbear said, copy another ship and just replace the lod mesh files only. Its a mess in-game but you can at least see how it looks. Im not ready to give away the asset, once im done with other models I want to try again (once i've recovered from the last attempt ;p ).

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Re: [WIP][Tutorial] Building your own ship for dummies

Post by ALEX Bemelmans » Tue, 5. May 20, 23:17

Axeface wrote:
Mon, 4. May 20, 18:06

You need to use blender 2.7 not 2.8 to get the uv textures option (its very annoying to have to do this extra step). Export your model from 2.8 and then import export from 2.7.
To get the model ingame I did what brummbear said, copy another ship and just replace the lod mesh files only. Its a mess in-game but you can at least see how it looks. Im not ready to give away the asset, once im done with other models I want to try again (once i've recovered from the last attempt ;p ).
already tried but i got another error... node anim_mainXlod0Xgeneric_p1_hulltexture has multiple meshes attached....

i m good in xml rework...i m bad in 3D modeling....maybe if we work together...
my textid range: 909700-909799

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Re: [WIP][Tutorial] Building your own ship for dummies

Post by BrummBear02 » Wed, 6. May 20, 08:24

Search the Tutorial for how to cleanup. Verticles. Do that. Also make sure that node has only one material
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Re: [WIP][Tutorial] Building your own ship for dummies

Post by ALEX Bemelmans » Wed, 6. May 20, 22:11

BrummBear02 wrote:
Wed, 6. May 20, 08:24
Search the Tutorial for how to cleanup. Verticles. Do that. Also make sure that node has only one material
after 8h52 of try retry and reretry in many different way, after reading 50X all tutorial i still have the same problem at export if i delete something it break..
impossible to make it... thanks anyway !

all this learn me how to use blender a bit and i found my working dirty solution and how to do it in less than an hour :lol:

the result ( it have all lod and collision ! it is not finished but it works) :
vulture m fighter
Show
Image
my textid range: 909700-909799

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Re: [WIP][Tutorial] Building your own ship for dummies

Post by BrummBear02 » Wed, 6. May 20, 23:03

ALEX Bemelmans wrote:
Wed, 6. May 20, 22:11
BrummBear02 wrote:
Wed, 6. May 20, 08:24
Search the Tutorial for how to cleanup. Verticles. Do that. Also make sure that node has only one material
after 8h52 of try retry and reretry in many different way, after reading 50X all tutorial i still have the same problem at export if i delete something it break..
impossible to make it... thanks anyway !

all this learn me how to use blender a bit and i found my working dirty solution and how to do it in less than an hour :lol:

the result ( it have all lod and collision ! it is not finished but it works) :
vulture m fighter
Show
Image
im stupid and im sorry. i wanted to add that cleanup part but after reading it again now i could not find it so i guess i never added it. anyway. u need to have only one material in it and when you select the node you press tab to go into edit mode. after that you press A to select all. then you go Mesh - Clean up - Delete loose.
now you switch to UV editor, move the mouse into the 3d model part of your window and press A so everything gets selected again. then move to the texture part and assign a texture. if there already is one you switch it to something else. doesnt matter what. after that you press the X to unlink all textures again. now your exported .dae should work.

i like your ship. i dont like the turret. it looks out of place and too big. but i think the ship itself fits the teladi very well!
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Re: [WIP][Tutorial] Building your own ship for dummies

Post by ALEX Bemelmans » Thu, 7. May 20, 04:35

do not worry,and you don t have to apologise, like i said all these manipulations were very useful for a real novice like me in 3D: take in hand the basic manipulations in "blender" and understand how it works for the ships and without your tutorial I would not have succeeded at all! thanks a lot

here my dirty technique of novice:

go to edit mode with "tab"
take all the dots you don t want with "ctrl" or "b" and put them appart to work quietly
using repeatedly "b" and "a", compress them into a little ball like you do with paper before putting it into trash
finally hide your little poop into the hull where nobody can see it
and voila! :lol:

and i found the way to change the gravity point but i have to replace all connections in xml but it works

edit: i tried your manipulation and it s ok now i have cleaned my ship thanks ( it is a lot faster....)
my textid range: 909700-909799

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Re: [WIP][Tutorial] Building your own ship for dummies

Post by ALEX Bemelmans » Fri, 8. May 20, 06:15

and it s done! thanks a lot again brummbear!
still have 3 little (xml) issues but very minor : my pilot diseapear when it get up and appear from nowhere when i get up coordinate looks good but i don t know
the ship id decal is always "AAAAAAA" and i lost somewhere screen decals from cockpit so they are all empty... :/

little question: how do i edit the wrench? because it is not exported in the dae?
my textid range: 909700-909799

Mike7495
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Re: [WIP][Tutorial] Building your own ship for dummies

Post by Mike7495 » Sat, 9. May 20, 13:30

I must be missing something. I've been trying to convert xml to dae for over a month. lol reading trying. I cannot get the xml files to convert over to dae. has anyone else had this problem?

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Re: [WIP][Tutorial] Building your own ship for dummies

Post by BrummBear02 » Sat, 9. May 20, 13:39

ALEX Bemelmans wrote:
Fri, 8. May 20, 06:15
and it s done! thanks a lot again brummbear!
still have 3 little (xml) issues but very minor : my pilot diseapear when it get up and appear from nowhere when i get up coordinate looks good but i don t know
the ship id decal is always "AAAAAAA" and i lost somewhere screen decals from cockpit so they are all empty... :/

little question: how do i edit the wrench? because it is not exported in the dae?
the wrench? you need to apply your modifiers there is a button for that. the pilots entry point is something in the xml file. id need to look that up too.
the AAAAAA thing is an issue with the converter. thats why my ships have their name edged in. i cant get the dynamic tailnumber get to work properly :(
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Re: [WIP][Tutorial] Building your own ship for dummies

Post by BrummBear02 » Sat, 9. May 20, 13:40

Mike7495 wrote:
Sat, 9. May 20, 13:30
I must be missing something. I've been trying to convert xml to dae for over a month. lol reading trying. I cannot get the xml files to convert over to dae. has anyone else had this problem?
well. yea. thats way too little info to help you. at the very least u dont convert xml files but xmf. xml have nothing to do with the actual 3d model.
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Re: [WIP][Tutorial] Building your own ship for dummies

Post by Mike7495 » Sat, 9. May 20, 13:57

BrummBear02 wrote:
Sat, 9. May 20, 13:40
Mike7495 wrote:
Sat, 9. May 20, 13:30
I must be missing something. I've been trying to convert xml to dae for over a month. lol reading trying. I cannot get the xml files to convert over to dae. has anyone else had this problem?
well. yea. thats way too little info to help you. at the very least u dont convert xml files but xmf. xml have nothing to do with the actual 3d model.
lol ok. yehhh I'm embarrassed Think I've figured it out. I miss read the beginning. I'm just going to blame it on my heart meds :D

ITs even worse. I did everything right!!! lol BUT Name on my folder was x4Mods not X4Mod. This is why nothing was converting. Im not an expert coder, but LOL I do know better than that. derp

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Re: [WIP][Tutorial] Building your own ship for dummies

Post by ALEX Bemelmans » Sat, 9. May 20, 18:13

@ brummbear
about modifier....
do i have to had the modifier collision to the collision meshes? because my collision have weird reaction like sometime it works sometime i can pass through object

i dunno if the problem come from my ship (the collision meshes was done like you said) or it a game issue with collision
my textid range: 909700-909799

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