X4 Version 2.0 Beta 4 is now available

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Fame
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Re: X4 Version 2.0 Beta 3 is now available

Post by Fame » Sat, 16. Feb 19, 12:41

Hello all,

By looking into reports of ver 2.0 Beta 3 it looks like that Xenon arent no wimps anymore... so looking forward to this :D When its done.


However here are some ideias that might be already in place in regards of "faction logic" or what i like to call "dinamic agressivness". Or mayby some else already stated them in the past without me knowing :?

A given race or faction has 10 on the scale of being agressive means that the faction is bent or fully commited to rule all the Universe having -10 it will have the attitude kill me i want to die ... lol... sorts off.
As pointers to make up this scale there are several stats about the player that could be used, such as fight rank, trading rank, faction relation or the number of Xenon killed, etc.
Using only one of this pointers is easier to put into game i think but makes the game pretty much predictable. And some uncertanty might be preffered. Spanning bigger number of ships is the easy road but using "clever" tricks such as camping on a bussy trade route, etc might be better.

The called dinamic part comes into it when its "races agressivness" is updated, higher or lower, based on the previous player stats versus current stats, over time. Some fail safes should or already are in place in order to avoid Paranid , as example to become the "new peacefull Goners" :lol:
I guess some of this is already in place but mayby with different names.
But i do understand that some or all of it might not even be possible due to other reasons which i do not know.

Ps: Since the impact will be great in each universe changes could/should be done in little baby steps if something like this is even possible in the first place that is :)

Cheers,
Fame
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Sam L.R. Griffiths
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Re: X4 Version 2.0 Beta 3 is now available

Post by Sam L.R. Griffiths » Sat, 16. Feb 19, 16:59

Fame wrote:
Sat, 16. Feb 19, 12:41
However here are some ideias that might be already in place in regards of "faction logic" or what i like to call "dinamic agressivness". Or mayby some else already stated them in the past without me knowing :?
Such an option has always been present in X-games, just not on the fly - those of us in the know call them mods. ;)

Personally, I do not support the idea of making the baseline experience more contentious unless it is done via opt-in logic means (e.g. sign up to the war missions and that kicks things off - albeit with warnings for the player). For those that have already signed up to war missions there should be the option for things to stay as-is.
Last edited by Sam L.R. Griffiths on Sun, 17. Feb 19, 08:04, edited 1 time in total.
Lenna (aka [SRK] The_Rabbit)

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"When eating an elephant take one bite at a time" - Creighton Abrams

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Re: X4 Version 2.0 Beta 3 is now available

Post by Shehriazad » Sat, 16. Feb 19, 17:40

Are there any plans to give NPC factions the ability to remove plots if they have built too many?

You stopped them from "usually" building too many...but I still see some cases where this happens i.e. when one is only semi-finished or has been destroyed.

Like a simple script that makes sure the oldest station plot is automatically removed when it exceeds the maximum number of plots you have allowed the AI to build?


I don't particularly fancy them having 6+ defense station plots that they keep trying to feed...some of these being exclusively from beta 3 and some remnants from beta 2.

Fame
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Re: X4 Version 2.0 Beta 3 is now available

Post by Fame » Sun, 17. Feb 19, 10:11

Personally, I do not support the idea of making the baseline experience more contentious unless it is done via opt-in logic means (e.g. sign up to the war missions and that kicks things off - albeit with warnings for the player). For those that have already signed up to war missions there should be the option for things to stay as-is.
I see your point. And its a good one. "opt-in logic" gives the player the option the start things when he/she is ready.
But i still think that after a while, several in game days the base line could use a little bit of "contentious activity". And by a little i really mean a little, even its only the pirates making the presence noted.
Not by a long shot as much as ver2.0 seems to bring along though.

Fame
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Re: X4 Version 2.0 Beta 3 is now available

Post by Sam L.R. Griffiths » Sun, 17. Feb 19, 10:39

Fame wrote:
Sun, 17. Feb 19, 10:11
Personally, I do not support the idea of making the baseline experience more contentious unless it is done via opt-in logic means (e.g. sign up to the war missions and that kicks things off - albeit with warnings for the player). For those that have already signed up to war missions there should be the option for things to stay as-is.
I see your point. And its a good one. "opt-in logic" gives the player the option the start things when he/she is ready.
But i still think that after a while, several in game days the base line could use a little bit of "contentious activity". And by a little i really mean a little, even its only the pirates making the presence noted.
Not by a long shot as much as ver2.0 seems to bring along though.

Fame
Arguably that was already there pre-1.60/pre-1.50, things have calmed down quite a bit for me after v1.60 - I used to regularly get notifications of pirate demands from my trade ships, but now such incidents seem to be not as frequent. However, that could as much be down to me building up my reputation with the factions as anything else. SCA are seemingly locked at -5 thus there is not much that I can do about that but for most of the other (non-inherently hostile) factions I have reputation levels of 24+ currently, the exception being the Ministry of Finance which is currently holding at +9 for now (had built up MIN rep a few times only to have it knocked down again because my trade ships were defending themselves in Teladi space).

Xenon raids have been sporadic in frequency so it is difficult for me to assess whether much has changed since v1.0 versus the current v1.60 experience.

As for baseline contentious activity, versus the player it should be dampened by having a good reputation with the relevant factions and should not penalise the player for themselves (or their assets) defending themselves against rogue elements when they are playing by the local rules (i.e. not trading in illegal cargo wares).
Lenna (aka [SRK] The_Rabbit)

"Understanding is a three edged sword... your side, their side... and the Truth!" - J.J. Sheriden, Babylon 5 S4E6 T28:55

"May god stand between you and harm in all the dark places you must walk." - Ancient Egyption Proverb

"When eating an elephant take one bite at a time" - Creighton Abrams

Fame
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Re: X4 Version 2.0 Beta 3 is now available

Post by Fame » Sun, 17. Feb 19, 17:26

... the exception being the Ministry of Finance which is currently holding at +9 for now (had built up MIN rep a few times only to have it knocked down again because my trade ships were defending themselves in Teladi space).
Happened to me also in regards of Min .... but none of my traders has any turrets instaled though as far as i know. I do have an (1) L freighter that has (1) defense drone with him :lol:
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Re: X4 Version 2.0 Beta 3 is now available

Post by biological » Mon, 18. Feb 19, 01:43

Autotrader jump range reduced to 4_5 intentional? Or bug due to the change to autominer?

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Re: X4 Version 2.0 Beta 3 is now available

Post by consiefe » Tue, 19. Feb 19, 09:47

biological wrote:
Mon, 18. Feb 19, 01:43
Autotrader jump range reduced to 4_5 intentional? Or bug due to the change to autominer?
Can it be pilot star levels?

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Re: X4 Version 2.0 Beta 3 is now available

Post by HBK » Tue, 19. Feb 19, 10:21

consiefe wrote:
Tue, 19. Feb 19, 09:47
Can it be pilot star levels?
Just like before. They just seriously nerfed the "jump range" you got. Right now it seems to be about 1 star = 1 jump. Previous versions were much more generous. Probably too generous granted, but current version seems to be one hell of a nerf. Going from 24 to 4 is quite the decrease.

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Re: X4 Version 2.0 Beta 4 is now available

Post by lordmuck » Tue, 19. Feb 19, 14:13

Ty for the update looking forward to see my torpedoes working again.. Praying you guys make a little priority on the the whole defend position/patrol/defend station and stopping ships from following the target all over the universe :)

CBJ
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Re: X4 Version 2.0 Beta 4 is now available

Post by CBJ » Tue, 19. Feb 19, 16:06

lordmuck wrote:
Tue, 19. Feb 19, 14:13
Praying you guys make a little priority on the the whole defend position/patrol/defend station and stopping ships from following the target all over the universe :)
It's definitely on our radar, partly thanks to you. I can't promise exactly when we will start addressing it, however.

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Re: X4 Version 2.0 Beta 4 is now available

Post by BrasatoAlBarolo » Tue, 19. Feb 19, 16:14

lordmuck wrote:
Tue, 19. Feb 19, 14:13
Ty for the update looking forward to see my torpedoes working again.. Praying you guys make a little priority on the the whole defend position/patrol/defend station and stopping ships from following the target all over the universe :)
Without this kind of behaviour, I wouldn't be able to explore Matrix 451, because one of my Ospreys followed a P there from Grand Exchange. One sneaky Osprey, and one even sneakier P.

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Re: X4 Version 2.0 Beta 4 is now available

Post by lordmuck » Tue, 19. Feb 19, 17:17

CBJ wrote:
Tue, 19. Feb 19, 16:06
lordmuck wrote:
Tue, 19. Feb 19, 14:13
Praying you guys make a little priority on the the whole defend position/patrol/defend station and stopping ships from following the target all over the universe :)
It's definitely on our radar, partly thanks to you. I can't promise exactly when we will start addressing it, however.
<3 epic !
BrasatoAlBarolo wrote:
Tue, 19. Feb 19, 16:14
lordmuck wrote:
Tue, 19. Feb 19, 14:13
Ty for the update looking forward to see my torpedoes working again.. Praying you guys make a little priority on the the whole defend position/patrol/defend station and stopping ships from following the target all over the universe :)
Without this kind of behaviour, I wouldn't be able to explore Matrix 451, because one of my Ospreys followed a P there from Grand Exchange. One sneaky Osprey, and one even sneakier P.
LOL!! cheeky

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Re: X4 Version 2.0 Beta 4 is now available

Post by flacwby » Wed, 20. Feb 19, 01:24

If this is the wrong area to post, please tell me.

Is anyone having issues in Beta 2.0 where stations are not ordering Drone Components and Smart Chips to build drones? It worked in 2.0 B1 that I know of but for the past 2 or 3 HF's none of my stations will build the drones I request. I even stocked the station myself with these components and their still not being built.

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Re: X4 Version 2.0 Beta 4 is now available

Post by lordmuck » Wed, 20. Feb 19, 02:44

flacwby wrote:
Wed, 20. Feb 19, 01:24
If this is the wrong area to post, please tell me.

Is anyone having issues in Beta 2.0 where stations are not ordering Drone Components and Smart Chips to build drones? It worked in 2.0 B1 that I know of but for the past 2 or 3 HF's none of my stations will build the drones I request. I even stocked the station myself with these components and their still not being built.
Dont know about the drone issue, have not touched anything like that in 2.0. However you should post Beta stuff here :)

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Re: X4 Version 2.0 Beta 4 is now available

Post by kevar » Wed, 20. Feb 19, 07:49

The Xenons are spawning defence stations!
The Xenons drop plots all over the place near the gates to their sectors but never got around to building them. Can't be destroyed. Is this intended?

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Re: X4 Version 2.0 Beta 4 is now available

Post by HBK » Wed, 20. Feb 19, 09:17

kevar wrote:
Wed, 20. Feb 19, 07:49
The Xenons are spawning defence stations!
The Xenons drop plots all over the place near the gates to their sectors but never got around to building them. Can't be destroyed. Is this intended?
Them spawning stations wouldn't be such an issue if said stations could be destroyed.

But alas, only the player can trick the targeting system to destroy them. AI can't target thus destroy incomplete stations, somehow resulting in factions spawning even more stations as they want those stations in the first place.

I doubt it'll be fixed for 2.0 (I'm not sure we'll get a beta 5, but who knows), but it'll be nice if AI could simply destroy incomplete stations.

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Re: X4 Version 2.0 Beta 4 is now available

Post by Alan Phipps » Wed, 20. Feb 19, 11:28

The Xenon spawning was fixed in 2.00 beta 4:

[Beta 4] Fixed factions building more defence stations than they should (problem introduced in 2.0 Beta 1).
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Re: X4 Version 2.0 Beta 4 is now available

Post by HBK » Wed, 20. Feb 19, 14:03

Alan Phipps wrote:
Wed, 20. Feb 19, 11:28
The Xenon spawning was fixed in 2.00 beta 4:

[Beta 4] Fixed factions building more defence stations than they should (problem introduced in 2.0 Beta 1).
I'm not sure how much stations they "should" build, but if necessary I'll upload tonight a save taken directly from 1.60 into 2.0 beta 4 where after a few hours LOTS of in this particular example Teladi stations were built into Xenon's own Scale Plate Green.

It seems to me like those stations were "destroyed" but not actually terminally destroyed (read removed) as AI can't target modules under construction, yet the faction considered those stations as destroyed and as such built new ones. But that's just a gut feeling.

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Re: X4 Version 2.0 Beta 4 is now available

Post by Falcrack » Wed, 20. Feb 19, 15:38

One problem is that the Xenon will select a plot to build a station, and I and everyone else can see this plot long before the defence station is actually started in any way. New plots from hostile factions should be invisible to the opposing factions. I've also collided with invisible stations, and also been able to shoot at (but not destroy) them. If the station is not started, there should be no collision check, but once a station has begun to be built, then it should be destructible.

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