Give it another try

[Nanook]

Yesterday I lost three merchants in a short time. Again strolling through Unknown (most likely Xenon-infested) Sectors.

So: Should I outfit them with fighter drones? If yes, which ones would you recommend?

Unlike in the "classic" X-universe, in Rebirth there are no Xenon sectors along trade routes...

Not quite true. While not technically a Xenon sector, Maelstrom often has strong Xenon fighter patrols at the south gate into Toride. I've had a number of my L-class freighters damaged or even destroyed by those patrols.

[RAVEN.myst]

Yesterday I lost three merchants in a short time. Again strolling through Unknown (most likely Xenon-infested) Sectors.

So: Should I outfit them with fighter drones? If yes, which ones would you recommend?

Unlike in the "classic" X-universe, in Rebirth there are no Xenon sectors along trade routes...

Not quite true. While not technically a Xenon sector, Maelstrom often has strong Xenon fighter patrols at the south gate into Toride. I've had a number of my L-class freighters damaged or even destroyed by those patrols.

Hmmm, I've never had my trade ships making trips into Maelstrom (which I fully consider a "Xenon sector"), but I guess that's because I don't find Toride and (to a lesser extent) Cold Star as economically significant - Home of Light, of course, very much is economically important (or can be - to me, it still usually isn't, unless I'm specifically playing there.)

[Ezarkal]

Hmmm, I've never had my trade ships making trips into Maelstrom (which I fully consider a "Xenon sector"), but I guess that's because I don't find Toride and (to a lesser extent) Cold Star as economically significant - Home of Light, of course, very much is economically important (or can be - to me, it still usually isn't, unless I'm specifically playing there.)

CS and TO give pretty good access to huge quantities of cheap AM/P/I-cells, refined metal and silicon wafers. In my current game, I'm setting up shop in DeVries, and I find the lack of proximity to those resources to be a bit troublesome. Well... found. Until I built like 4 cellfab matrix and a decent number of metalwork yard. XD

...You see, I'm playing with CWIR and I'm currently enemy with both PMC and HV, so it's pretty damn hard to send ships in any of the HOL DLC systems. It's crazy how the most basic resources are what's actually pulling you back when you put yourself in certain conditions.

[RAVEN.myst]

CS and TO give pretty good access to huge quantities of cheap AM/P/I-cells, refined metal and silicon wafers.

Yup, I know - but my playstyle is all about establishing autonomous economies (and I play only vanilla), as I dislike MORTing all the time - and in Rebirth vanilla station freighters can't leave their systems. Hence, I stop MORTing ASAP, only doing so for as long as I need to before I start my station-building, and only because I dislike running missions for income even more

It's crazy how the most basic resources are what's actually pulling you back when you put yourself in certain conditions.

Yup - in Albion this is particularly noticeable as PMC has monopolies on refined metals, silicon wafers, cut crystals, nividium cubes, and RMP (well, there's a Ledda ArmsTech Fab that very very occasionally has a small amount of surplus RMP, but it's *extremely* rare, and very little - can't be relied on in any way.) I once, in one of my very first games, pissed off AES by boarding one of their Midirs - lack of access to energy in any form was a BIG problem!

[Nanook]

...
Hmmm, I've never had my trade ships making trips into Maelstrom (which I fully consider a "Xenon sector"), but I guess that's because I don't find Toride and (to a lesser extent) Cold Star as economically significant...

Well, I don't either. However, the shortest distance to HoL from OL and back again is through Maelstrom and Toride. So when I tell a freighter in OL/HoL to go buy/sell something in HoL/OL, they always fly through Maelstrom and Toride to get there. It's at the gates that they usually encounter Xenon problems. Even the one from Toride to HoL can be a real problem for a lightly armed freighter. And when there's a queue at the gate, things can get really dicey.

[RainerPrem]

...
Hmmm, I've never had my trade ships making trips into Maelstrom (which I fully consider a "Xenon sector"), but I guess that's because I don't find Toride and (to a lesser extent) Cold Star as economically significant...

Well, I don't either. However, the shortest distance to HoL from OL and back again is through Maelstrom and Toride. So when I tell a freighter in OL/HoL to go buy/sell something in HoL/OL, they always fly through Maelstrom and Toride to get there. It's at the gates that they usually encounter Xenon problems. Even the one from Toride to HoL can be a real problem for a lightly armed freighter. And when there's a queue at the gate, things can get really dicey.

Hi,

They still queue up for crossing gates? Ah, now I know what those fan-shaped gatherings of ships are. So this is the reason why crossing Verdant Profit takes so much time...

cu
Rainer

[RainerPrem]

Hmmm, I've never had my trade ships making trips into Maelstrom (which I fully consider a "Xenon sector"), but I guess that's because I don't find Toride and (to a lesser extent) Cold Star as economically significant - Home of Light, of course, very much is economically important (or can be - to me, it still usually isn't, unless I'm specifically playing there.)

Hi,

At the moment my big stations are still being built and need more money than they produce. So MORTing is both a source of income and a source for RMPs and fusion reactors. And when you sort the Best trades window by profit, the top ranks are taken by the Teladi Overwatch and some Toride stations. They have no hinterland of their own.

cu
Rainer

[RAVEN.myst]

However, the shortest distance to HoL from OL and back again is through Maelstrom and Toride.

Granted - but as you see from the post just before yours, I don't MORT extensively, and almost never such long distances, as by the time I've explored that far, I've quit ad hoc trading and am getting my moolah from my stations.

And when you sort the Best trades window by profit, the top ranks are taken by the Teladi Overwatch and some Toride stations.

Indeed - annoying, eh? Well, I generally deliberately don't get trade agents at Toride and Cold Star until after I've stopped MORTing, and I ignore the Teladi Overwatch trades (occasionally if I'm not paying attention I might select it by mistake, but I almost always realise my mistake before my ship gets there.) Incidentally, I assume you know that if you expand a particular ware's trades, you get alternative (less profitable) trade options; I'd rather take the second-best (hell, even the third or fourth or fifth or... well, ANY other) trade than send my freighters into Teladi never-never-land.


Happy hunting

[RainerPrem]

Hi,

two things:

1) Am I the only one who gets reminded to "X-Files" when listening to the music in Home Of Light? Sometimes there is also a hint of "The Hall of the Mountain King"...

2) Does the tooth fairy exist in X:Rebirth? Each time I dock, there is a gift box on one of my weapons.

cu
Rainer

[RAVEN.myst]

a gift box on one of my weapons.

*blink*blink* I... don't understand.

As for the other question, I can't say I made a connection, but when last I played in that area, I had music turned off and some TV series (probably sci-fi, hehehe - hell, possibly even those same chronicles of Mulder and Scully ) running on my other screen. Next time I visit the Home of Neon Lights, I'll pay more attention

[RainerPrem]

a gift box on one of my weapons.

*blink*blink* I... don't understand.

When the Skunk is docked and you walk around there is one weapon lower than the others. Often there is one of the small metal boxes lying on it. Often filled with diamonds or gold nuggets.

cu
Rainer

[RAVEN.myst]

a gift box on one of my weapons.

*blink*blink* I... don't understand.

When the Skunk is docked and you walk around there is one weapon lower than the others. Often there is one of the small metal boxes lying on it. Often filled with diamonds or gold nuggets.

cu
Rainer

Oh, I see - thanks for that, I didn't know (I tend to ignore boxes, except for ones I happen to walk by on my own ships/stations - I leave the rest alone as I consider that to be stealing (as well as highly improbable that people would leave stuff of value simply lying around ) I'll go make sure there are no potential hazards on my weapons - would hate for my guns to jam mid-combat

[RainerPrem]

Hi,

a summary after a long gaming weekend:

1) X:Rebirth is definitely a game to enjoy.

2) X-1,2,3 fans definitely have to re-learn a lot of mechanisms. But that doesn't mean that the newer ones are worse. (apart from being restricted to a single ship)

3) The interaction with stations - in spite of the improvements - becomes tedious over time. For me it's mainly the fact that the station layouts are "always the same" after some time. I accept that creating new layouts is a tedious and boring job for a software developer, but they did some of it for the main game galaxy, but then fell back to Albion design for most HoL stations. Suggestion: with increasing rank with factions, scanning their stations should be easier and perhaps on +20 stop completely.

4) Those boxes ... a nice idea for the beginning, but they should slowly disappear during the game. At a certain point you can make money otherwise, and find items you need in lockboxes and containers anyway.

5) The HoL system is nice, the pathfinder abysmal. The idea of Highway stations is good, but they should have a little more importance for the game and not just being eye candy. The Terracorp HQ is absolutely underwhelming and anticlimactic. I would have expected an impressive station here.

6) Since exploring the new systems is part of the game there should be hints to the existence of other zones, which are not connected to the highway network. I constantly use Drow's map as reference, but consider that basically cheating. Suggestion: Offer missions to unknown zones with little reward.

7) The pathfinder is ... bad. The GPS in my car is sometimes bad as well, but at least I can see where my destination lies and decide for another route. When doing missions in X:R the pathfinder lets me run in circles through the highways (especially in Inner World and Eclipse Clouds with their multi-highway-hub zones), and in HoL points me to the highway for a round trip through all sectors, even if my destination is just in the previous district 40km by foot.

cu
Rainer

PS: Freighters should NEVER EVER fly through zones the player hasn't yet found. Losing a ship in "Unknown Zone" when docking to "Unknown station" for refueling is one of the most aggravating game features at all.

[RAVEN.myst]

1) X:Rebirth is definitely a game to enjoy.

2) X-1,2,3 fans definitely have to re-learn a lot of mechanisms. But that doesn't mean that the newer ones are worse. (apart from being restricted to a single ship)

It certainly does have its charms.

3) ...Suggestion: with increasing rank with factions, scanning their stations should be easier and perhaps on +20 stop completely.

At reputation somewhere around 28ish, all of that faction's stations get revealed to 100% (requires a game restart or reload to update once the reputation level is reached, hence I don't exactly when it happens.)

4) Those boxes ... a nice idea for the beginning, but they should slowly disappear during the game. At a certain point you can make money otherwise, and find items you need in lockboxes and containers anyway.

I don't even use them for money in the early game - too much like cheating to me off an implausible situation of people leaving valuable stuff lying around. But boxes on my own assets are fair game - the bits that don't go into crafting stuff I just keep - my collection is quite impressive, I don't know where I keep it all - maybe in the same stolen Timelord tech that squeezes 50 marines into my ship's baggage compartment. Incidentally, I took a look at where you pointed me, and sure enough, some member of the ground grew had left a pack of smokes on that gun! Very careless, the tar could possibly have gummed up the works, assuming it didn't simply fall off on take-off. The pack went into my collection...

5) ... The Terracorp HQ is absolutely underwhelming and anticlimactic. I would have expected an impressive station here.

I so totally agree! For starters, it's nothing more than a reskinned warehouse; secondly, I'd expect it to be far more imposing looking - huge and perhaps a little intimidating, embodying as it does the seat of power in that system. Also, it ought to be buzzing with activity, and not just mess-traffic, but also standing security forces, and perhaps a couple of "navy" ships being based/supplied there.

6) Since exploring the new systems is part of the game there should be hints to the existence of other zones, which are not connected to the highway network. I constantly use Drow's map as reference, but consider that basically cheating. Suggestion: Offer missions to unknown zones with little reward.

Something I do in the Teladi Outpost areas as well as some of the new Home of Light areas: when you inquire about some missions, keep an eye on the picture part of it - some of them show you the sector map, then zoom into the relevant location. You can get an idea (or, if you have a photographic memory, a precise picture) of where the other zones are.

7) The pathfinder is ... bad. The GPS in my car is sometimes bad as well, but at least I can see where my destination lies and decide for another route. When doing missions in X:R the pathfinder lets me run in circles through the highways (especially in Inner World and Eclipse Clouds with their multi-highway-hub zones), and in HoL points me to the highway for a round trip through all sectors, even if my destination is just in the previous district 40km by foot.

Indeed. Also, I've found a bug (not sure whether it's new or old, as some of my habits have changed a little, so it may have been there all along) - in part of Inner World (and I think Ascendancy too), while on autopilot in highways one can get stuck not just in a loop, but one that involves the ship spontaneously teleporting to another location (if I recall correctly, one of the places I experienced this was approaching Serpentine Driveway, but there were a couple of others too.)

Freighters should NEVER EVER fly through zones the player hasn't yet found. Losing a ship in "Unknown Zone" when docking to "Unknown station" for refueling is one of the most aggravating game features at all.

Agreed. Alternatively, very high-skilled captains could travel to areas unknown to the player (as a result of a high Navigation skill, perhaps) - but in doing so map the area in for the player. Also there REALLY need to be ways to control routes that freighters take without having to babysit them - plot routes, blacklist sectors, stuff like that...

[RainerPrem]

Hi,

positive development. After needing three hours and a lot of reloads I finally boarded a Reiver Titurel in deVries. (0% hull) Although the ship needed another hour or so until it was moving again, it survived, because my trusty Taranis killed all appearing Reivers.

And now I found the right hunting ground for freighters. In Cold Star/Albert's Theory ATL Rahanasses are appearing very regularly at the jump beacon. The only problem is to stop them before they reach the vicinity of one of the stations.

cu
Rainer

[RAVEN.myst]

And now I found the right hunting ground for freighters. In Cold Star/Albert's Theory ATL Rahanasses are appearing very regularly at the jump beacon. The only problem is to stop them before they reach the vicinity of one of the stations.

Yup, in a recent experimental game of mine (was testing some warehouse functionality - findings will be published soon, once I get a round tuit) I did the same. It is in fact so silly, like proverbial fish in a barrel - I was just busy securing one when the next one would arrive, I could have kept it up indefinitely, but ended up calling it quits after a half-dozen, which were useful for my test.

[JimmiG]

Another returning player here. Just put in another ~20 hours the past weekend.

I'm surprised they haven't implemented a way to blacklist sectors for trading and/or traversal. I mean we got SETA and the jump drive, but such a simple thing...A 5-star captain should know better than to fly a slow lumbering freighter with paper-thin hull into a known hostile sector, when there are safer alternatives available.

Also I'm surprised how many of the incredibly frustrating and repetitive gameplay elements haven't been fixed. Like having to play that ridiculous small-talk mini-game to reveal skills or get trade offer updates. Imagine having to staff a dozen ships and unlock an entire system for trading, without using mods like Show Skills and TAF or Fly-by Subscribe. Did any of the Egosoft playtesters actually think that constitutes enjoyable gameplay?

The game really tries hard to be as frustrating as possible, but with mods and a ton of patience, you can find a fairly enjoyable game underneath.

[RAVEN.myst]

... having to play that ridiculous small-talk mini-game to reveal skills or get trade offer updates.

Apparently, as of the next update there will be another way to acquire trade agents: by killing hostile ships near the station in question. It's not ideal, but at least it's an alternative.

Imagine having to staff a dozen ships and unlock an entire system for trading, without using mods like Show Skills and TAF or Fly-by Subscribe.

I don't have to imagine - I play pure vanilla, no mods whatsoever. In my current game I have hired 1565 staff members, on account of having to hire and fire repeatedly to find skilled labour (that, or the even more tedious expedient of "smalltalk"...) Yes, far too much time is spent (read: "wasted") on busy-work such as "smalltalking" for those trade agents and acquiring competent personnel...

[RainerPrem]

... having to play that ridiculous small-talk mini-game to reveal skills or get trade offer updates.

Apparently, as of the next update there will be another way to acquire trade agents: by killing hostile ships near the station in question. It's not ideal, but at least it's an alternative.

Imagine having to staff a dozen ships and unlock an entire system for trading, without using mods like Show Skills and TAF or Fly-by Subscribe.

I don't have to imagine - I play pure vanilla, no mods whatsoever. In my current game I have hired 1565 staff members, on account of having to hire and fire repeatedly to find skilled labour (that, or the even more tedious expedient of "smalltalk"...) Yes, far too much time is spent (read: "wasted") on busy-work such as "smalltalking" for those trade agents and acquiring competent personnel...

Hi,

my opinion about that is not sooo bad. Between running/flying around as fast as possible and doing dogfights, it can be soothing to cool down enough and concentrate on those games.

If you reduce them to ONLY acquire trade agents and ask for suitable staff, they are not too annoying. For me it's more confusing when people in HoL want to talk about Plutarch (they shouldn't even know the name). Or if Split complain about human holograms.

cu
Rainer

PS: Does anybody know in which file I can find the text lines from the smalltalk and the tips? I want to send a list of typos to egosoft.

[RainerPrem]

Hi,

am I the only one wondering about the pathfinder problems in Toride?

Out in the East of the sector I was scanning an anomaly, and flying through sent me directly to one of the civilized sectors in the far West.

My accompanying Taranis was completely confused. It constantly switched direction between roughly South and roughly North, turboing in both directions alternately. Can it be that the distance between the zones is somehow calculated wrong? And why doesn't it just jump to the beacon in Lacrimosa?

cu
Rainer